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German Bishops Allow Holy Communion for the “Remarried” Now

After a somewhat more extended period for its preparation, the long-awaited pastoral and doctrinal document (“Word of the Bishops”) of the German Bishops’ Conference concerning the application of Amoris Laetitia has finally come out. As the German Bishops’ website,, reports today: “The Remarried May Receive Communion in Individual Cases.” This piece of news, unsurprisingly, is already being reported internationally.

As the new document – published today, 1 February 2017 – says, “not everybody whose marriage is broken and who is remarried” may go to the Sacraments, to include the Sacrament of Penance. The bishops propose a process of discernment in order to decide whether such a “remarried” couple, or individual persons, may receive the Sacraments.

The German Bishops’ document – which is dated 1 February, but which was already adopted by the bishops’ council itself on 23 January 2017 – also says that Amoris Laetitia (AL 300) does not “categorically exclude” the “remarried” divorcees from the Sacrament, since in some cases, there is not to be found “serious guilt [sic].” The text, as expected, also refers to the controversial paragraph – paragraph 305 with its footnote 351 – and claims that not everybody who is in an “objectively irregular situation” is in the state of sin, or at least “not completely so”. Moreover, even though not every couple per se may be admitted to the Sacraments, the German bishops say that, for some couples, indeed, “Amoris Laetitia opens up the possibility of receiving the Sacraments of Penance and of the Eucharist.” [my emphasis] However, this should also be done, according to the bishops, with the help and accompaniment of a “pastoral caretaker.”

It is in this context and situation of discernment that the German bishops – with explicit reference to Amoris Laetitia (37) – stress the importance and weight of the individual consciences, as such, which may not then come to be effectively “replaced by the Church herself.” The document thus says:

The individual decision – under the individual circumstances – not to be yet able to receive the Sacraments deserves respect and esteem. But, one also has to respect a [individual] decision in favor of the reception of the Sacraments. [my emphasis]

The German bishops do stress the formation of conscience, which has to take place, as well. But, while they reject both extremes of “laxity” or “rigorism,” they still subtly give much scope to the individual couples who now may decisively discern themselves – with the help of an accompanying and discerning priest (or another pastoral caretaker) – whether or not they should receive the Sacraments yet. The Church, according to the German bishops, would then have to respect their own decision, as the last quote also implies.

Image © Raimond Spekking / CC BY-SA 4.0 (via Wikimedia Commons)

Thus it seems that even the German bishops do not yet go as far as the Maltese bishops with their own new guidelines – who have stressed even more explicitly the weight of the individual conscience – but the Germans come quite close to it. This, of course, should not be astonishing, since the German bishops – among them Cardinal Walter Kasper himself – have been recurrently pushing for the indulgent laxening of the Church’s morality concerning the “remarried” divorcees, and for a long time.

This is how it sounded, already back in 1993, when Kasper, together with two other bishops, first proposed to implement in southern Germany the “Kasper proposal” (as it is now called) – now almost 25 years ago:

The priest [in discerning with the couple their individual case] will respect the judgment of the individual’s conscience, which that person has reached after examining his own conscience and becoming convinced his approaching the Holy Eucharist can be justified before God. [my emphasis]

Back then, the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith stopped this initiative. It is helpful in this context, moreover, to know that Cardinal Gerhard Müller as the Prefect of that same Congregation has just unequivocally said that there cannot be a contradiction between doctrine and the individual conscience, and he then added:

For example, it cannot be said that there are circumstances according to which an act of adultery does not constitute a mortal sin. For Catholic doctrine, it is impossible for mortal sin to coexist with sanctifying grace. [my emphasis]

Cardinal Müller also insisted – with reference to Familiaris Consortio 84 – that “remarried” divorcees have to live in sincere and enduring continence if they wish to receive the Sacraments. That topic, however, is not even at all being discussed by the German bishops’ own new statement.

This very troubling new document from the German bishops comes at a time where one of the German bishops – Archbishop Heiner Koch, of Berlin – has now even declined to make a moral judgment upon the sinfulness of homosexual unions.

For example, on 30 January, 2017, the German progressive newspaper taz published an interview with the German archbishop of Berlin which mainly deals with the question of homosexuality. While Koch insists that the word “marriage” means a union between a man and a woman, because it is open to life; he then makes the stunning remark that “I have respect about how they [homosexual couples] are living out their own sexuality – since I assume that they are doing it responsibly.” [my emphasis] When the journalist asked him why the Church is so sure that a homosexual is living in the state of sin, even though Jesus Christ Himself has not made such an explicit statement on the matter, Koch answers: “You wish that I make a general judgment about an individual person. That I will not do.” [my emphasis] He thus refuses to proclaim the Church’s own moral teaching on homosexuality and its acts.

As can be seen here, the dissolution of Catholic Doctrine continues to grow in Germany.

Update, 2 February: According to a article of today, the “remarried” divorcees may not necessarily need to contact a priest for the discernment of their individual situation with regard to the Sacraments. I myself had understood the German word “Seelsorger” as meaning a priest; however, I might have been mistaken. I will try to follow up on this matter with the German Bishops’ Conference itself.

Update, 5 February: According to our new findings, I replaced in this article now the word “pastor” with “pastoral caretaker” which is broader and which indeed includes laymen, as well.

125 thoughts on “German Bishops Allow Holy Communion for the “Remarried” Now”

  1. So the dioceses in Malta and in Germany are in heresy now, along with assorted other dioceses throughout the world. I suggest an electoral college style map indicating which dioceses have left the Church so that the faithful have a handy guide.

      • Oh heavens …an empty map..because Bishops and Pastors are so very
        very silent. They could be sent a questionnaire …How Catholic do you
        rate yourself?..maybe a dubia could also be sent. Anyone not answering could
        be listed as un-Catholic.

    • How great is that..a web site full of maps…worldwide ..indicating dioceses which
      are safe for the believing Catholic, those that are borderline and those which should be totally avoided…perhaps with a bit of work all parishes could be rated
      on fidelity to the Church…very handy indeed.

  2. Question: Are those who discern themselves not to be committing adultery also allowed to be given the Sacrament of Matrimony? If not, why not?

    • There you go..selfie annulments and selfie re-marriages, especially for those responsible loving sodomites. ….oh I forgot …selfie absolution.

  3. The German Church, with a few exceptions, are a filthy lot of perverts that need clearing out. That is the place where all this rot has emanated from, as it did five hundred years ago. Their undoubted involvement in the K of M affair underlines their financial influence – they hold the purse, just as Judas did. Roll on the Imperfect Council & a boot in their collective backsides.

    • Yes Ana Milan! The time is coming. A teensy,tiny bit more time, so the disguises fall of the traitors of God. They are smug now and so very full of themselves.
      Let it be seen, so that the division is very, very clear as to WHY and there will no excuses given to our Lord as to which side one shall be on.

    • There were about a half dozen Bishops of minor German Sees who opposed Kaspar during the Synods. They need to speak up now more than ever.

      • Yes they certainly should. I often wonder why these prelates ever went forward for ordination in the first place? Aside from those actually planted by communist agents in the ’30s & ’40s, I can only assume it was because of easy access to young men & boys. No straight man would ever consider the priesthood in its present state!

        • Myself and some of my friends are discerning a vocation to the Priesthood. Strangely enough, we are all attracted to the TLM, even if we attend the NO due to certain circumstances. I am most certain that the Lord is calling me to the Priesthood, even if I protest its current state. However, He gently reminds me that my will is not greater than His, and that if I wish to serve Him I must do so humbly. I really hope and pray that I may be an instrument of His to restore the Church to Her ancient glory and dignity. All I know is, the parishioners in my Parish want me to be a priest precisely because they want real Priests. Even the NO parishioners are fed up with the current state of the Church [and certain of them really hate Pope Francis which show his actions are waking people up]. One was even lamenting to me this past Sunday how Priests are no longer respected as they should. But, he encouraged me not to be afraid, if I trust in the Lord.

          • God bless guide and protect you on your path. You sound very sincere and in love with Jesus which is the true foundation of the holy priesthood.

          • Thank you. Oh, I often rant to Him about things going on in the world and in the Church, but I know He understands. Oh, We are quite a pair, I think! I know He wants to be involved in everything, so I speak to Him as my brother. But at other times, such as at Holy Mass and during Divine Office, I entreat Him reverently, remembering that my Brother is also my King. I keep a diary of all that is taking place, so that I have a physical record of His work in my life. God bless.

          • I am in a position in my life right now to offer prayer in the midst of pain and suffering. I will include you, Mark Anthony, that you may serve our Lord as His faithful priest. Jesus I trust in You!

          • May God bless you, my friend, in bearing your suffering. Lord knows, He makes me carry such heavy crosses, but He burdens some with greater crosses as others, as you are burdened, because He wishes to perfect you unto a stronger Faith. Say to Him everyday: O my dearest Jesus, I recall Thy bitter Passion for my salvation. Thus in return, I suffer this cross at Thy pleasure, so that I may imitate Thee, my good Jesus, and I offer all my suffering for the salvation of Thy Church. May God give you peace in your suffering, and may Our Lady bring you healing, even if it be of the soul. God bless.

          • I am glad to hear that. We have usually around 22 or so seminarians in Malaga but about one third go to Honduras. Even forty years ago I was told by a priest that if he stayed at home he would lose his faith, hence the exit. In general, people are getting fed up wth training young people (not only the priesthood but that also) only for them to immediately go abroad. The resident priests are completely silent (complicit?) on the state of the CC & go along with everything the NO Bishops say rather than follow their own conscience. One has to wonder where the dividing line is between ‘obedience’ & ‘surrender’. It is good that you know TLM & can access it. Nobody but old folk know it here as it is not allowed, despite PB’s no abrogation – as he didn’t mandate it, it fell on its face. No Diocesan seminarian is taught Latin so it seems if there is to be a revival we shall be totally dependent on the Traditional Orders to get the restoration up & running.

            My local priest says he’s traditional but doesn’t want to rid us of the Protestants who share our church, hasn’t put out the confessional or changed the Tabernacle to centre stage for fear of offending these people, doesn’t have a Holy Water font etc. They retain a key to the church while we Catholics who built it are prevented from entering except for Holy Mass.

            I wish you God’s Blessing.

          • The Venerable Fulton Sheen famously said that the laity will save the Church, because they shall remind their Priest’s who they are meant to be. I can only pray that God may be so generous as to grant me a family who will remind me of my duties as their father to lead them to Eternal Life.

            I would suggest that you offer your Holy Communion’s in reparation to the Sacred Heart of Jesus for your Priest. Perhaps, you can ask the Holy Spirit to pour upon yourself and your brethren in your Parish the Fear of the Lord, so that you may be given courage to humbly admonish your Priest.

            God bless, my friend.

  4. I pray the bishops and priest will read the scriptures and teachings of the church, for it’s a more terrible thing for a priest or bishop to lose his soul, how much more demons will hate and torment them if they are lost, what a terrible thought. I pray the bishops and priest will stand up for Jesus and his truths and not send him to be trampled upon.

    • I believe, we (The CHURCH) have a situation right now and here (actually, there are a multiple very obvious cases) when we must use another word / term, and not just ‘schism’. The time is, I believe, here an now to read carefully (again) some prophecies. As a two good examples I suggest the prophecies of st Francis of Assisi, and other one from venerable Fulton Sheen.

    • Brian can you maybe clarify something for me (and others)? There is a lot of talk of schism. But why is it schism and not merely rampant heresy? After all schism is a claiming of illicit jurisdiction, isn’t it? Would it not be more accurate ot compare this to, say, the rampant Jansenist heresy of the 17th and 18 centuries which took over practically whole countries too? Well I am just a layman so don’t know the technicalities but it is all a very sorry state of affairs one way or another.

      • Actively and openly misguide the faithful ones, (or less faithful but still the sheep of the flock entrusted to him) and lead them in the way that the poor sheep, who is already a sinner, make even more and greater mortal sins,- can not be called just a schism. It is a I. class heresy.
        We do not need to be canon lawyers to know that, with all respect to all good (CL) ones.
        – “And by this we may be sure that we know him, if we keep his commandments. He who says “I know him” but disobeys his commandments is a liar, and the truth is not in him.” (1 John 2,3-4)
        So, those who are liars, and without TRUTH in them, are not just schismatics.

    • If a Catholic priest, when he says the proper formula for the consecration of the Eucharist over the proper matter (wheat bread and grape wine), does not intend to do what the Church does, then the consecration is invalid, and the bread and wine remain mere bread and wine.

    • The German Catholic Church is filled by anti- Catholics . From the Laiety, Priests to Bishops the German Catholics suffer from the Luther Complex and want to finish what Martin Luther couldn’t finish turn the Roman Catholic Church into a twin Church of the Protestant Church. The
      German Catholic Church is a dying irrelevant Church not worthy to be called
      “Catholic” and will be history in the nearer future. Liberalism and
      cowardice conformist priests kill the faith. The main problem is that Pope
      Francis is leading the church all over the world into the same way of destructive
      liberalism of German Church. The German bishops are still full of pride despite the fact that their Churches are empty, dying and they have failed. It’s really ridiculous and insane that these German Bishops, theologians, a bunch of losers with empty and dying Churches have so much influence inside the Catholic Church and are allowed to bring ruin on Catholism. The German bishops are very rich and are therefore powerful since money talks also in the Church. In Vatican II German Theologians had a strong influence on the Vatican II documents . How telling that Pope Francis can’t stop talking about povery and the poor Church but sides with rich German bishops that excommunicate every believer that doesn’t pay the church taxes. They love to talk about mercy but they have no mercy for people who don’t pay Church taxes. The German Bishops refuse to change this law since when it comes to money, their taxes they are very conservative, rigid and don’t like change. They have are removed themselves from the Gospel and the Catholic faith beyond belief. The Point is that the German Church makes official what was/is already common practice in German Churches everbody can receive Communion without any restriction . Keep in mind the German Bishop Kasper promoted the idea that divorced remarried people should receive communion in the name of mercy since 30 years. He was handpicked and elevated by the Pope to become the STAR of the Synode.

  5. Maybe Cardinal Muller has something to say about this while Pope Francis is doing whatever he does?
    That we can have this bile thrown at us by these frauds while Cardinal Muller does his interview with “Il Timone” is a magnification of the tossed salad bull that continues to emanate from the Bergoglian hotel. This is a joke. The men participating in this are a joke. And they are the ones laughing at us on our dime.
    It is filth. It is disingenuous. It is unacceptable. It is a sacrilegious desecration of their office and our standing in the Church.
    Get lost and get real jobs.

  6. We have the right to know if our diocesis are Catholic or Kasperite. Every single Bishop MUST answer the Dubia in public to clarify. Their silence have to be taken as a sign of schism.

    • I put the question exactly as you say to my Bishop.

      I sent him the copy of the Appeal to Prayer by the Kazakh prelates and asked him if he stood with them or with Kasper.

      I got no response.

      None. Notta. Zilch. Zero. Null.

      And by that I mean I got a bigger response than he could have sent if he had replied with a thousand pages.

        • Well, I’m not surprised, but I have written him in the past, by the way, and he has responded on various topics, including marriage. His responses are certainly orthodox, but this one crosses the line, see, I suspect because it is now…”political” and while general statements on the “indissolubility of marriage” seem to be quite easy for prelates to make, declaring alliance with or engaging in argument against those who are willing to fight for it…isn’t.

          And that is a picture that says a thousand words.

          Bergoglio has been a blessing in that he has flushed out many snakes from the woodpile. They have come out all over, supporting his direction in leading the Church into chaos. And then there are those who are boldly and courageously standing up, priest and prelate alike.

          But still we have those who think it best to remain “above it all”, “not taking sides”, possibly repeating the teaching of the Church at times, but not willing to engage in conflict.

  7. “Paging Cardinal Muller……paging Cardinal Muller………..please pick up the white courtesy phone……”

    This is homoheresy. Cardinal Pell said after the 2014 Extraordinary Synod that the issue of Communion for the divorced and civilly remarried was simply a stalking horse for the big issue; blessing/accompaniment of homosexual “relationships” and Communion for those involved therein.

    Marx, Kasper, Woelki et al…….these guys are all flamers. The Lavender Mafia has the Church in a choke-hold.

  8. Their guidelines aren’t even consistent. First they say that not every divorced and “remarried” person will be readmitted to the sacraments, but then go on to state, “The priest [in discerning with the couple their individual case] will respect the judgment of the individual’s conscience, which that person has reached after examining his own conscience and becoming convinced his approaching the Holy Eucharist can be justified before God.”

    Great, so the only ones not admitted will be those whose consciences are not at peace with God (i.e. those who recognize they’re actually in mortal sin), and thus would never present themselves in the first place. Brilliant.

    • Don’t forget those who, unwilling to support a schismatic national church, opt of paying the Kirchensteuer. These are not only denied the Sacraments, but even a Catholic funeral.

      • The unjust hath said within himself, that he would sin: there is no fear of God before his eyes. For in his sight he hath done deceitfully, that his iniquity may be found unto hatred. The words of his mouth are iniquity and guile: he would not understand that he might do well. He hath devised iniquity on his bed, he hath set himself on every way that is not good: but evil he hath not hated. Ps. 36:1-4

    • So here we have it the final arbiter of the penitent is the PENITENT. Cardinal Wuerl was saying that God is the final judge. Well yes…Cardinal Wuerl, but who do you think is IN the confessional with the penitent? It reveals their abject lack of belief in the priest as another Christ. Looking into the eyes of Cardinal Marx in that top picture gave me the willies.

  9. Two thoughts:

    Firstly, if a pastor is given the go-ahead to “discern” whether a divorced couple or individual can receive the Eucharist, then why not just let pastors give out marriage annulments? After all, if the diocese wont give an annulment, but yet the pastor gets the final word, then why not make it simple and transfer annulments to the parish level?

    Secondly, who’s actually monitoring these shacked up divorcees in the Communion lines? Is each Communion recipient required to do a finger scan to bring up their status as they come up ? In my local Parish nobody would know! Amoris Laetitia must be addressing these small village parishes where only the parish priest distributes Communion and knows everyone personally.

    Of course there is that example of a woman living it tough somewhere in Brazil that Tim Staples provided.

    • “Firstly, if a pastor is given the go-ahead to “discern” whether a divorced couple or individual can receive the Eucharist, then why not just let pastors give out marriage annulments? ”


      This is what hit me some time back.

      But then, if it’s all just personal conscience then not even the priest matters.

      As others have mentioned, this is simply Protestantism, and one or more prelates need to risk their jobs and simply stand up like men and say so.

      • I thought 4 have already done so. Problem is, the faithful ones don’t want to further injure the Church. Problem is this wound needs to be lanced, big time, and it’ll take some strong, faithful doctors to do so!

      • They are not just heading to having the local pastor hand out quick and
        easy annulments but for each couple to decide on its own whether or not the
        marriage is valid. With this type of thinking the positions of local Bishops and all the Cardinals in Rome etc. are numbered anyway… so why not take a stand
        for Christ and His Holy Church.?

  10. So at what point does this turn into “The Catholic Church Hasn’t Changed It’s Teaching, We Just Don’t Say It Like That Anymore?”

    You know, just like “Outside The Church There Is No Salvation”…

    • What to say about statements of the clergy who are saying: “We are not ‘owners’ of the truth!”, “We are not the only one whom faith knows the truth.”… “So let’s force ecumenism!”,… “Let’s pray together… (yes, with the heretics)”. … “But wait, it’s not enough, let’s catch that ‘wonderfully’ spirit of Assisi, and let us pray with all possible heretics around the whole globe.”
      But they will not get my amen to their prayers! I will never be a part of the new church of the new world (order).
      Because one very simply thing, I will, pray, live and really keep trying to go to the Heaven, after this life, but not to the Hell.

      • +1

        My statement is merely a reflection on what has happened in the Church, the collapse of leadership, of the papacy, of integrity, of decency.

        Ultimately, it is PEOPLE who want desperately to sin; so-called faithful, prelates, people..

        We need desperately to have a Church that actually cares enough about them to direct them back on the narrow path to salvation.

  11. Let me ask you; If you were an adulterer, homosexual, remarried, or in some other way a soul deviating from the natural law, Church doctrine and the commandments, would you be more or less likely to refer your ego as your conscience?

    What does that tell you about the bishops proposing this forfeiture of responsibility?

    As a remarried adulterer you would have the responsibility of judging the priest, yourself and the Church.
    That’s a big responsibility. Don’t you think?

  12. where I live, Buenos Aires, Argentina, they’ve been doing this for years, without exhortation or papal permission.

  13. “Wherefore God gave them up to the desires of their heart, unto uncleanness, to dishonour their own bodies among themselves. Who changed the truth of God into a lie; and worshipped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed for ever….”

  14. Just a couple of things that I have to say in the face of all things rubbish…

    “Since you have made it expressly clear that you have no intention of defending Church Teaching, and since you insist on driving into heresy and schism the Church in [name of Country], We have but one action to take regarding your abomination, O wandering and erring Brethren. In this Our Bull, We hereby place the Church in [Country] under Interdict, and by this We utterly forbid the following:

    1) The celebration of any of the Sacraments and also of the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass,
    2) The Christian burial of any of the Faithful,
    3) The public celebration of the Canonical Hours,
    4) Religious processions of any kind.

    We also herein summon to Our Presence here in the Vatican, to appear before Us, the Bishops of [Country]. And by diverse punishments, We hope to correct your unspeakable crimes against the Church and Her Spouse. We also herein command the Clerics and Laics of [Country] to do much penance for what has taken place, both now and in prior times. We shall, in accordance with the discipline of the Church, exact the severest Penalties upon you for deserting the Flock, and for committing treason against Our Lord and for refusing to submit in holy obedience to the Vicar of Christ.” [Bull of Interdict Against [Country]]

    “After having summoned your Bishops to Our Presence, We then proceeded to lay to their charge the neglect of the Faithful, and the subverting of the Catholic Religion, as handed to us from the Apostles of old. Then, having summed up their crimes, We then turned to yoke them to their penances. We had originally planned to order all the Bishops to wear the monastic habit, to refrain from receiving Holy Communion for three years and to fast for the same three years, especially on Fridays, but by Divine Revelation, We concluded that some of them were not even worthy to receive correction, for their very presence moved us to disgust, even more so when they tried to defend their disgusting behaviour.

    Therefore, deeming it wise and prudent, and with the good counsel of Our Venerable Brethren, the Cardinals of the Holy Roman Church, We have hereby not only dismissed from the Clerical Order all the Bishops of [Country] who defied Us, but have in the same wise excommunicated them from the Holy Society of the Church, handing them over, as the Apostle states, to the Devil for the destruction of their flesh, that their souls may be saved on that dread Day of Judgment. The other Bishops who accepted their penances, shall do so under Our supervision.

    Therefore, dearest Sons of the Holy Priesthood, We have been given a list of names of holy and most loyal Priests and from this same list We shall elect new Bishops, wise and sober and sound in Faith, to become your reverend and God-bearing Fathers. So, dearest Sons, pray earnestly that the Lord of all Providence may so enlighten Our mind as to those whom He sees fit to be established as Shepherds over His House. And We also wish to give Our humble gratitude to those dear Sons who wrote to Us, ensuring their constant prayers for Our governance over this Sacred Barque of Peter. Be assured, that Our love for the Church and Her children is so great, that We spend entire nights in prayer before the Divine Presence of Our Lord in the Tabernacle, petitioning Him to look with love and pity upon this Temple of His Glory.

    In fine, We wish to confer upon you and your Faithful, Our paternal Benediction.” [Letter to the Priests of the Church of [Country] concerning their Bishops]

  15. I’m going back to the beginning – Adam didn’t divorce Eve…..if he had then each of us little human creatures would not be here to comment about anything.

  16. More variations of jesuit-speak. Loopholes you could drive a truck through.
    I stopped caring about the German Church, its a waste of time. They are the walking dead.

  17. Ever see “Judgment at Nuremberg”? Remember the end, where the Burt Lancaster character protests that he (as a Nazi judge) never meant things to go that far, and the Spencer Tracy character (as an American judge) says it went that far the first time he allowed an innocent man to be condemned? Did the German hierarchy go as far as the Maltese? Will others go further later on? The real problem remains that a reigning Roman Catholic pontiff has seen fit to muddy the waters where negative precepts of the natural moral law are concerned. Amoris itself is a footnote too far.

  18. In May 2016 I walked across the bridge over the River Neisse which separates Gorlitz in Saxony from the other half of the city which is now in Poland. So, if I did that walk today, Church discipline (and by implication doctrine) would change radically in 60 seconds?

  19. This is what happens when you mistakenly think a Pope can never promulgate error. He places the key to theological revolution in an unobtrusive footnote. 200 pages of decent Catholic writing. One little paragraph of error. He claims it is now part of the Magisterium. Therefor, binding on us all. We must assent and not question the error’s conflict with the grand Magisterial edifice. The Pope has spoken, (all the others who have gone before, forgotten).

    “Amoris Laetitia opens up the possibility of receiving the Sacraments of Penance and of the Eucharist.”

    A subtle twist, but profound.

    AL opened up nothing new, except the possibility of Mortal abuse. AL, instead, opens up the possibility of forgiveness without repentance and change; Eucharistic communion while still bound to mortal sin. Holy God is not in that exchange. It matters not what the current Pope says about it.

    Catholics in any sinful situation were ALWAYS allowed Penance and Eucharist, no matter what they had done or how bad. Grace, Repent, Confess, Penance, Forgiveness, Eucharist: a divine formula for salvation. AL did not “grant” that. It merely emptied the exchange of its power for salvation.

      • Yes, it manifests like this. But it is is enabled by “that”.

        “That” is the inverted submission of Magisterial Truth to the Pope’s living, personal authority in service of the “needs of the day”. “That” is also the clericalism that prevents anyone from questioning this fatal inversion, and providing needed correction while there is still time.

        When St. Peter is walking away from Rome (2,000 years ago) and from his essential duty of martyrdom for Jesus’ sake, he needs a peer; a St. Paul level peer, to turn him back to his duty before he is judged eternally and the Church is weakened by his failure. By the Grace of God, Peter was given a final chance (again). He repented at the end. A perfect Papal lesson for these times.

        Pope Francis now needs correction by his peers (just clarity really … answer the Dubia!). The living, suffering members need these elevated peers (Cardinals/Bishops) to choose this difficult path. All of us; Pope Francis, Bishops, Cardinals, so many faithful, need this before Judgement; before Christ makes it right in His own power.

        The ultimate apostasy would be to “”Sede” question the Papacy itself. There are others who will answer for that. But NOT me. I am to be faithful in my “station”, and that means not letting anyone change the clear doctrinal words of Christ and His Church, regarding faith and morals.

        • Okay, fair enough. A couple of questions to examine this a bit further, Aqua:
          Would you agree that St. Paul corrected Pope St. Peter for his *behavior* and that there was no heresy, apostasy, or schism?
          Do you agree that the bad behavior exhibited by Pope St. Peter is different from heresy, apostasy, or schism?

          I’m not asking this to say “Gotcha”; l just want to put it to bed that somehow Pope St. Peter’s mistaken behavior is somehow equal to the universal apostasy that the men who wear white and live in Rome have endorsed for the past 59 years. Make sense?

          • No. Not just bad behavior. Heretical belief, I suppose,though it was all still being defined and settled by the Apostles. Canon Law was a long way off.

            And I don’t know about “equally” serious, but serious enough to merit central placement in St. Paul’s Letter to the Galatians. Gal 3: 27 – 29 describes the true nature of a Christian, AFTER St. Peter’s fraternal correction. PRIOR to that he was advancing incorrect practices and belief. St. Peter was stuck in the Jewish cult of worship. St. Paul reminded him of the power and nature of Christ, in whom we have our Christian unity and purpose.

            The Pope must, at times, stand corrected. That is the main, relevant point. This is not bad, or insubordinate. In fact, this is a time in which correction would be a mercy to the Pope himself, and to us all. His peers must be willing and wise to provide it humbly and with respect; at times they must insist on it (the Dubia). Then, the Pope must be humble and wise to receive the grace and change, as needed, when departure from Truth is proved.

          • I agree with you on the correction. While a pope can be mistaken in his private capacity (books, sermons, and such things), he can be corrected in this regard. However, as a public heretic, apostate, or schismatic as the pope, that’s a different story.

          • Thanks. Using the prior example again, St. Paul did not need formal heresy definitions applied and Court rulings to know St. Peter’s teaching was not just wrong, but fundamentally fatal to the Christian Faith.

            Our current living “peers” of the Pope are no different. They also face a crisis that goes to the very Sacred Beating Heart of our Church. And just like St. Paul, they need not, should not, wait 25 years for the Church to definitively rule and define on a mortal threat to souls and the Christian Faith. This is their primary calling, defending the Faith.

            What must it have been like to confront Jesus’ chosen Apostle “to his face”?! St. Paul,was filled with much Grace. May it also be so for our current Bishops and Cardinals. This is their time; their task. Do not wait for tomorrow’s correction, which may never come!

          • I understand your fundamental point and agree completely–like 97% agree.

            Where we probably differ is that l have a legitimate doubt as to their Catholicity since almost all of them are rotten and/or embraced a new religion: the Novus Ordo (which is hostile to Catholicism). l look at them like a Catholic would look at the Arians or the formerly Catholic clerics who defected to join Henry VIII or Elizabeth l. I haven’t watched your posts, so l don’t know your stances. That being said, l sense that you want to do the right thing and my prayers are enclosed for you and your undertakings.

            Peace and all good, always,

          • How can both of these simultaneously be true?

            1. “A Catholic pope cannot give anything harmful.”

            2. A Catholic pope can publish books for the faithful, and deliver sermons to them, which contain content that is “mistaken” (i.e. your silly euphemism for error).

            The question is obviously rhetorical as your sedevacantist position, however you may confuse it with expressions “private capacity” (like books and sermons are private), clearly violates the law of non-contradiction.

            It is also no longer welcome here.

          • You are correct that popes can and should be corrected for sinful behavior. However, that being said, a pope cannot be a heretic, schismatic, or an apostate–a non-Catholic, in other words.

  20. Remember the Catholic Church teaching that those who take Holy Communion in a state of mortal sin get NO BENEFIT whatsoever from it. Christ is literally locked out of their soul. All they get is another mortal sin — sacrilege — each time they do this, and some much-desired ‘human respect’ from the onlookers at Mass. Isn’t that what this is really all about? To pat them on the back as being in ‘communion’ with the Church, when in fact they’re NOT? Christ is of course betrayed and offended when someone does this, and His Presence mocked. And let’s not forget the HUGE sin of the priests who guide people along such an erroneous path. It’s truly a scourging of the Body of Christ. I was in Austria recently, and noticed even there, no one bothers with Mass. Our hotel couldn’t even give us accurate info on when Sunday Mass was at the Catholic Church right up the street. The true faith is drying up like little puddles during a hot drought. “And will not God vindicate his elect, who cry to him day and night? Will he delay long over them? I tell you, he will vindicate them speedily. Nevertheless, when the Son of man comes, will he find faith on earth?” (Luke 18: 7-8)

    • No one bothers with Mass there because really, what’s the point? It has been emptied of its power, in Germany at least.

      I Cor 1: 17,18

      • You’re right indeed. There’s nothing like our seeing it for ourselves this past year, to thoroughly impress upon us the gravity of the lack of Catholicity there. And their Churches, though practically empty, are so gorgeous with centuries of inspiring artwork, sculpture, and the finest construction materials. Majestic organs, one of which we had the privilege to hear being played — and I recognized the piece as Bach’s. It’s exquisite celestial nature (Bach, though Lutheran, must have loved God very much) brought tears to my eyes, to hear that sacred musical beauty amid the crumbling Catholic society. God must cry many, many tears.

        • What you describe is the product of an ancient culture leavened with true Catholic faith for Centuries. Cathedrals and buildings, art, music, politics; all reflected a society oriented at the cellular, personal level to Almighty God. They are the fruits of previous generations’ faithfulness.

          In our day, we see similar efforts oriented toward other more secular priorities: Stadiums and sports have taken the place of Cathedrals and Catholic faith. Cathedrals today are just slowly decaying relics bequeathed to us by our forefathers. The leaven of a vital, transforming, Grace-filled faith is missing. Sex and sports pervade everything, instead of true Charity, fidelity and worship; in every home in every place.

          Perhaps, though, the tide is turning. Clarity is required to see the threat already growing, previously hidden, within. I am thankful for clarity, at least.

    • For a baby-boomer you have a great sense of what is Catholic and what is not. Christ does not come to a soul in the state of mortal sin.
      So glad you mentioned the word soul….one of the many beautiful theological terms
      which priests have cleansed from their vocabulary.

      • What a wonderful affirmation…thank you. I had a reversion to my faith 20 years ago, partly due to the innocent questions and curiosity of our young children then, and partly due to a re-awakening in my own soul as to the true state of it. I’m a product of Catholic school, though that didn’t help enough during the 60s and 70s…they actually taught too much error. I am convinced that my solid Catholic spouse, and the redemptive nature of our trying to earnestly raise children in the Faith, (plus the fine example of my parents) all contributed to a renewed quest in me to learn Catholicism for real, to read original writings and scripture, and to study the reason behind teachings I’d formerly invalidated. I haven’t stopped since, and have dedicated my professional business to it. Catholicism is serious stuff, but immensely interesting and satisfying. It engenders the greatest interior peace I’ve ever known, once I recognized the reasons for all my previous stress, consternation and unrest. It has so many benefits, like new flowers in our garden each day.

  21. And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

  22. Now a priest who is a heretic can nevertheless possibly dispense a Sacrament validly, but only if all the essential conditions for validity are met, just as for any priest, including the intention to do what the Church does.

  23. So the question arises as to what would constitute a failure to intend to do what the Church does, on the part of a Catholic priest attempting to consecrate the bread and wine. One such failure would be a heresy on the Eucharist. If the priest adheres to a heresy on the Eucharist, particularly on its consecration, on transubstantiation, or on the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist, then he does not intend to do what the Church does. His attempted consecration would therefore be ineffective and invalid. The bread would remain bread; the wine would remain wine.

  24. Here’s the piece that I really don’t understand. This “internal forum” or “discernment” process or whatever one wants to call it has existed here in our Diocese in California for decades. And I would wager that this is not the only place in the U.S. where such procedures are in place.

    Where have the objections been prior to AL?

  25. So, here’s what the Catechism of the Catholic Church teaches us about what’s happening RIGHT NOW in the Church:

    CCC§675 : Before Christ’s second coming the Church must pass through a final trial that will shake the faith of many believers (cf. Lk 18:8; Mt 24:12). The persecution that accompanies her pilgrimage on earth (cf. Lk 21:12; Jn 15: 19-20), will unveil the “mystery of iniquity” in the form of a religious deception offering men an apparent solution to their problems at the price of apostasy from the truth. The supreme religious deception is that of the Antichrist, a pseudo-messianism by which man glorifies himself in place of God and of His Messiah come in the flesh (cf. 2Thess 2: 4-12; 1Thess 5: 2-3; 2Jn 7:1; 1Jn 2:18, 22).

    Isn’t much of what Pope Francis passes off as ‘mercy’ and ‘Catholic’ an obvious religious deception? Isn’t the situation in Germany, for example — wherein priests and bishops are now allowing the irregularly divorced-and-civilly-remarried (without Decree of Nullity) reception of Holy Communion — a Catholic farce? What’s HOLY about receiving Communion in their state of open sodomy or adultery? They are opposing Christ to His Face, and doing so out of desire for human respect and to ‘bend’ the rigidity of a Church they don’t want to really obey. Isn’t this a DECEPTION and scandal by those prelates — who, like Bishop Barron, want to come across as modern, informed and compassionate? The Church has never taught ‘gradualism’ or continual ‘discernment’ (a few other of Francis’ goodies that sound nice, but are huge errors) be used while someone slowly changes his ways. Nope. Change or don’t receive the sacrament unworthily.

    It seems that a Catholic who considers himself true to the faith in its entirety, is being put to an unmistakable test today. Do we go along to get along? Or do we stand firm for Truth, and let the chips fall? Do we want to be liked, “cool”, fit in at work and around town? Are we embarrassed to stand for our faith? Are we unafraid to lose jobs, friends and stature — oh, and money. Christ said, “Let what you say be simply ‘Yes’ or ‘No’; anything more than this comes from evil”(Matthew 5:37).

    Time to call a spade a spade.

  26. Pope Benedict needs to speak up as do the Majority of red hat Cardinals and support Mueller at last AB , Pell ,,Burke ,Sarah and Dubia retired Cardinals…….. Sad to say Francis is out to lunch ,oblivious to the Apostasy he is causing or needs to read RC catechism as bishop of G. Ukrainian Eastern rite told him to do.

  27. The following German prelates are opposed to allowing civilly divorced and remarried Catholics to receive Holy Communion : Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI, Cardinal Paul Cordes, Bishop Stefan Oster, Bishop Konrad Zdarsa, Bishop Gregor Hanke, Bishop Rudolf Voderholzer, Bishop Friedhelm Hofmann, Bishop Wolfgang Ipolt, Archbishop Ludwig Schick and Cardinal Joachim Meisner., and Cardinal Gerhard Müller, prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith.


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