Last week, I told you about a document from a group of Argentine Bishops in the Buenos Aires region that made provisions for allowing certain divorced and remarried Catholics who were not living in continence to receive both the sacraments of Confession and Communion.
A papal letter was also published as a response to this document, in which Pope Francis indicated that he believed the document to be “very good” and that in terms of its approach to Amoris Laetitia, there could be “No other interpretations.”
The question was the letter’s authenticity – did it exist, and if so, was it really from the pope? In an update to my original post, I shared a link to a LifeSiteNews story that includes a scanned copy of that letter, which you can view here (PDF Link). Examining the letter, wee see two important elements of verification.
First, the papal coat of arms on the letter:
Compare this to the papal coat of arms that appears on the Vatican website:
Second, the signature. While it appears inexplicably small at the bottom of the letter, it is nonetheless legible:
Here it is, zoomed in 500% and sharpened:
An image of the pope’s signature appears on a Crux article about Amoris Laetitia that looks strikingly similar:
Another example of his signature can be taken from this image of his signed note in the guest book of the European Parliament in Strasbourg in 2014.
It appears to me that there is, therefore, sufficient reason to believe that — barring any denial from the Vatican that this letter is a forgery — this letter provides authentic documentation that Pope Francis approved of the Argentinian bishops’ interpretation of AL. Again, their document states, in part (and here I will use the LifeSiteNews translation rather than Google’s, with my emphasis):
5) When the concrete circumstances of a couple make it feasible, especially when both are Christians with a journey of faith, it is possible to propose that they make the effort of living in continence. Amoris Laetitia does not ignore the difficulties of this option (cf. note 329) and leaves open the possibility of receiving the sacrament of Reconciliation when one fails in this intention (cf. note 364, according to the teaching of Saint John Paul II to Cardinal W. Baum, of 22/03/1996).
6) In other, more complex circumstances, and when it is not possible to obtain a declaration of nullity, the aforementioned option may not, in fact, be feasible. Nonetheless, it is equally possible to undertake a journey of discernment. If one arrives at the recognition that, in a particular case, there are limitations that diminish responsibility and culpability (cf. 301-302), particularly when a person judges that he would fall into a subsequent fault by damaging the children of the new union, Amoris Laetitia opens up the possibility of access to the sacraments of Reconciliation and the Eucharist (cf. notes 336 and 351). These in turn dispose the person to continue maturing and growing with the aid of grace.
Add this to the already smoking gun of Francis’ airplane interview answer on this topic from back in April. To refresh your memory, here’s the video of the relevant portion:
It is now, I think it’s fair to say, beyond reasonable doubt that Francis was the author of this letter. That he approves of the Argentine bishops’ document (even as it has now disappeared from the Infocatolica website pending “revision” after garnering so much publicity — as has their copy of the pope’s letter, both of which they now comment on here.) That he has always intended to create a pathway for the divorced and remarried who are living in adultery to receive the sacraments, and that he approves of those bishops and cardinals who have implemented this interpretation.
UPDATE: Just moments after this was posted, I was offered verification that yes, Francis wrote the letter, from no less authoritative sources than the Vatican’s official newspaper and the Vatican News Network. It’s the real deal.
Agreed. If it was a forgery the Vatican Press office would have denounced it at once, which they did not do… Furthermore, there was never a sufficient reason to doubt it’s authenticity in the first place, as it is impossible to read chapter eight of Amoris Laetitia (may it be forever consigned to the dust bin of Hell) and not see that it clearly embraces Cardinal Kasper’s corrupt proposal to allow for a path to communion for objective adulterers who some how remain subjectively innocent…all the while refusing to accept the Church’s teaching on Marriage and sexual continence.
The people who are trying to cast doubt on it’s authenticity are not doing themselves or any of the brethren any good service in regards to the problem at hand.
Denial of the obvious isn’t a river in Egypt, it’s the folly of man in the face of an undesired truth (which is usually the result of Pride.)
They have to deny its authenticity, Father, because if they do not, then the entire “conservative/neo-Catholic” narrative we have been hearing for the past five months—that Francis hasn’t changed doctrine or practice and that to read AL in any way other than in continuity with tradition is just wrong! wrong! wrong!—collapses under its own shaky foundation.
After this weekend, I am convinced that this right now is the critical moment, the moment we’ve been conditioned for decades to believe could never happen: A reigning pontiff has affixed his signature to a document that incontrovertibly violates a matter of faith and morals, however clandestine the document may have been intended to be. How much longer the mainstream Catholic media will continue to deny the obvious is beyond our control, but thanks to the Internet, we now have undeniable evidence. The real question now is: What happens next?
It´s very probable that the actual author of the “Criteria” written by a group of Argentinian bishops is Mons. Victor (Tucho) Fernandez.
Radio Vatican has just dispelled any lingering doubts: http://en.radiovaticana.va/news/2016/09/12/pope_endorses_argentine_bishops_document_on_amoris_laetitia/1257635
Well, that settles it, then.
It’s like they don’t even care any longer. They’re putting this insanity out there, knowing just how much it contradicts Church teaching, and they couldn’t care less. Their utter contempt for faithful Catholics knows no bounds . . . no bounds at all.
And now there will be people who will not accept this report from Radio Vatican because the Pope himself didn’t publically admit to writing the letter…watch it will happen. Just like they did when Fr. Lombardi clarified the Pope’s infamous statement on the allowance of contraception (with discernment of course) as in: ‘Yes, the Pope did say that contraception can be used for certain situations like Zika, with discernment.’ The people who were most adamant in denying the Pope said what he said stayed in denial of it even after Lombardi, his official Press spokesman, clarified it.
With some people (read “neo-Catholics”), you could have video of Francis signing a document contrary to the Catholic faith, his fingerprints proven to be on the pen he used, and Francis wearing a sign around his neck reading “I just changed 2,000 years of Church teaching and all I got was this white cassock”, and people STILL would make excuses for him (e.g., “The video was forged!”; “The Pope uses ballpoint, not fountain, pens!”).
We’re beyond the point of mere heads in the sand. We’ve progressed to elective lobotomy and the abandonment of all objectivity and common sense.
Yes, and I am afraid there are many traditionalists who just cannot wrap their heads around these truths either. I stand with Ann Barnhardt.
Looks like a certain internet priest blogger is doing what I said would happen. “news story” in scare quotes about the Radio Vatican report.
Disappointing, yet not surprising.
EDIT: Some time before 7:45 p.m. today (September 12), the online priest personality in question updated his blog and has conceded, based on the reporting in L’Osservatore Romano, that the document is, in fact, real. Better late than never, I guess, but not exactly comforting to those of us who suspected its authenticity from the beginning.
Yeah, saw that: however, he is still in denial about the significance of it. For him (publically anyway) it’s not a big deal, every one remain calm, nothing to see here.
Can I assume we’re talking about Fr. Z? Whom at this point I usually don’t even bother to read because I’m allergic to anodyne?
Yes, I was referring to Fr. Z, just left his name off as I didn’t want to go down a rabbit whole and I knew the LB would know to whom I was referring.
Fr. Z you mean? Has been suspect to me for quite some time now.
As ususal, there will be doubters … no doubt about it. But the facts speak for themselves, to anybody who has ears to hear.
It seems that nothing can move Pope Francisc to reconsider his stance. Not even the recent theological critique put together by a group of eminent theologians and shipped to the Dean of the College of Cardinals back in July, even though it clearly identifies no less than eleven patently heretical propositions in Amoris Laetitia.
Keep in mind that at least 2/3s of the College of Cardinals voted for him. So, pardon the pun, but they’re all in bed together.
Father glad to see you on here. I am so upset with this Pope and I have tried to defend him with my husband, but no longer can. Between his appointment of Paglia with the sex education in the Varican, to his going to confession for using plastics and wanting to change the works of mercy, to his climate change baloney, to his many liberal appointments and now this, I can no longer support him. What happens if we have a heretic in the Vatican? Are we gong to have a schism? What is a faithful Catholic supposed to do? And I am sure you heard about Father Check? Are the liberals trying to destroy that to? If I didn’t know Jesus Christ was in that tabernacle and know there were faithful priests like you and the few I know at home ,I would leave the church, but where can I go Lord? Totally frustrated! And I checked Voris isn’t saying a word. What is wrong with them? God help us !
Will there be a schism? We could argue, and this website has done so, that there is already a schism. The lines simply are not clearly drawn yet. As for what to do with a heretic in Rome? Well, we’re not entirely sure. We’ve never had to deal with this before. One could argue we did with Honorius who was anathematized but, as I was pointed to yesterday, he likely wasn’t a heretic in the usual sense, but was lumped with them for allowing them to continue to spread heresy, even if he did not share their views. So this is a new one.
The bigger and more important question for most of us, who are not bishops or honored theologians, is what do we do? What do *I* do? It’s the same thing it’s always been. Love Our Lord, trust in Him. Pray to Him. Get close to Our Lady. Ask for her help and aid. Consecrate yourself and your family to her Immaculate Heart. Pray the Rosary. Go to Mass as often as possible, daily if you can. Find good, faithful, Catholic priests. Find a Traditional Latin Mass if there’s one even within an hour drive… maybe more if you can make the sacrifice. Read about the saints. Read good traditional spiritual books. And don’t sweat what’s going on in the Vatican. Yes, we should know and be on guard. We need to know what is coming so we can protect ourselves and others from error, especially our families. But aside from that, it doesn’t really matter what the hierarchy is doing, not for your day to day. Stay faithful to the Gospel which has been handed down. Trust in Our Lord’s Promises. Yes, we’re under attack. Yes it’s in a new way that we haven’t quite seen before, but it’s still the same old wolves in sheeps clothing we’ve been dealing with for 2000 years. The Church has passed through 3 great crises, 2 massive schims, and she will pass through this too. This is the 4th great crisis, as Bp. Schneider calls it, and we’ll make it through. Stay close to Our Lord in the Eucharist and Our Lady. He’ll carry you through!
“Find a Traditional Latin Mass if there’s one even within an hour drive..”
Not that simple. Except for sedevacantists Tradiitional catholics offer mass, to God, in union with Francis. How is it a solution to ask God to accept a Sacrifice being offered in union with someone one believes is a heretic? On the other hand, some sedevacantists, deny that what Catholics have been communing with since Vatican II are validly consecrated hosts. Said assertion by some sedevacntists sounds sacrilegious and blasphemous to me as well.
How does one avoid sacrilege except by worshiping God “in Spirit and in Truth” (John 4:23-24), as He promised one day it would come to be.
The Seat of Peter remains the Seat of Peter and until we have some very solid evidence to the contrary, meaning the Church proclaiming this with authority, then Francis remains Pope. Even if he’s a disgrace to the seat. Even if he’s fallen into material heresy. If he’s still the Roman Pontiff then the words of St. Boniface VIII should resonate within us “Now, therefore, we declare, say, determine and pronounce that for every human creature it is necessary for salvation to be subject to the authority of the Roman pontiff.” And so, while we do not stand with this man, we stand with the office he holds.
I, for one, am not going to be so bold as to say I have the ability to determine if he is the Roman Pontiff. All the evidence I have says he is, unfortunately. And should the seat become or be declared vacant, we still need to attend Mass. The liturgy is the primary means God uses to save us. What do we do without the liturgy? Without that we might as well become hedonists… or at the very least become protestants.
Do not give in to despair, and if reading these things brings despair, then stop reading, go pray, and love the Lord.
DO NOT DESPAIR! “You are Peter and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell will not prevail against it. … I am with you until the end of the age.” Our Lord has not abandoned us. Cast your cares on Mary’s Most Immaculate Heart and trust in Our Lord’s promises!
I don’t despair because I believe Jesus is divine and am certain he will be good on his promise to be with us until the end of time. But my conscience, in loyalty to Him, does not permit me to pray, or consent to a priest praying on my behalf, in union with someone who I believe is a heretic. Doing so, I believe, would be a grave offense against Truth, against Christ.
In Luke 12:57 Jesus challenges: “Why don’t you judge for yourselves what is right?”, while in John 8:32 he instructs us to continue in his word, which will set us free. One cannot continue in his word while professing to be joined with someone one believes is a heretic. And one is not excused from judging between truth and error.
The fact that one does not have authority over Christ’s Church does not excuse one from abiding in truth nor is it a license to act against reason or in error. The fact that one can not personally depose a papal claimant who one believes is a heretic does not excuse one from public profession of allegiance to him at a mass. It isn’t as if there is no salvation outside of the liturgy, but rather, there is no salvation outside of Chrtist, which means absolute allegiance to Him! (One is still able to recite the sacred liturgy privately or in union with other remaining faithful – without the consecration – without expressing allegiance to Francis or to those allied with him. The first Christians hardly had a liturgy, except for Christ’s words transubstantiating the bread and wine.)
One cannot make allegiance to a human (the papal claimant), and not God, the absolute criteria. Just take a look at the logical consequences of the former position. If said papal claimant were to teach that Satan was God and announced that he worshipped him, by making him the absolute criteria one would be bound to still profess allegiance to him — until the claimant is somehow legitimately deposed according to some method not revealed by God or infallibly by His Church. In such case, if you were to pray the Our Father at a mass, who would you be referring to, the papal claimant’s God? If not, then how is it that you are professing to God your allegiance to the claimant? If you in fact (privately, secretly) don’t have allegiance to the claimant, are you not lying to God?
“How is it a solution to ask God to accept a Sacrifice being offered in union with someone one believes is a heretic?”
This is the same question that pre-occupies my mind during the Eucharistic Prayer at Mass. How does one pray for a man who was either never validly elected or who has lost papacy by virtue of remaining steadfast in teaching outright heresy?
I don’t have any easy solutions, Al; I don’t think any of us do. However, what I try to do is keep in mind that when in the Te igitur of the Canon the priest prays for the Supreme Pontiff, the text that follows reads et omnibus orthodoxis atque catholicae et apostolicae fidei cultoribus (“as also all orthodox believers and professors of the Catholic and Apostolic Faith”).
If our reigning pontiff, by his own actions, cannot therefore number himself among the “orthodox believers and professors” of our Faith, then we will simply have to pray for those who can be numbered, however few they may be. Plus, who knows? If enough of us pray fervently for this pontiff that he have a true and contrite change of heart and direction, then maybe, just maybe, it will come to pass.
The priest prays on one’s behalf; if one is participating, one is giving consent to what he prays. One can’t just in one’s heart omit the parts one doesn’t agree with for that would be less than honest participation. If one is not participating, what is one doing there?
Please allow me to clarify. I believe one can and should pray for him, even if one believes he is a heretic, but only if one is praying for him to convert. That’s what one should do for any heretic, as with sinners. But the Church and the mass presuppose unity between Christ and the Pope, and between the latter and all orthodox believers. However, if one believes the papal claimant is a heretic one cannot honestly presuppose this. The Traditional, and the New Mass Eucharistic prayers refer to the pope as God’s “servant.” But if one believes he is a heretic how can one also believe he is God’s servant? And if one doesn’t believe he is God’s servant, how can one honestly refer to him as that in prayer to God?
One can be a very bad servant. There’s even a parable our Lord gave us in Matthew 18 I believe it was.
That said, there is this… you seem to already be most assured that your assessment (that Bergoglio is not Pope) is correct. In short, there is no pope. If you are so concerned about this particular issue then perhaps it is time you go to a sedevacantist chapel. They surely can’t be schismatics if there really is no pope and they’re the only ones who won’t offer Mass in union with “Francis, our pope.”
My contention is that there is no solid evidence that he’s not. There just isn’t. So, at Mass, which we Catholics have a moral obligation to assist at if we are physically capable of getting there, perhaps it is best to say a private prayer for docility in spirit until we have a certain word. We can use our reason, but there is not enough evidence much less precedent to conclude definitively that Francis was never elected to the papacy or that he lost the papacy because of heresy. I’ve seen most of the evidence out there to conclude Francis is not Pope. But there’s not enough to become certain, and in such a serious matter as this, we need to be 100% certain.
But follow your conscience I suppose… and if that means attending a sedevacantist chapel, well, I guess that’s what you have to do.
Sounds to me like perhaps you didn’t read my first brief post to you carefully enough, for you are mischaracterizing my position. Again, here is what I wrote about sedevacantists:
” On the other hand, some sedevacantists, deny that what Catholics have
been communing with since Vatican II are validly consecrated hosts. Said
assertion by some sedevacantists sounds sacrilegious and blasphemous to me as well.”
Rather than give me advice why don’t you just first answer the questions I raised in to my response to you? See below – it’s the one that b begins: ” I don’t despair because I believe Jesus is divine…”
You are as responsible as I am before God in terms of what you communicate to other Catholics.
Yes there will be a schism as prophesied at Akita.
I have been doing all of that, but it is so discouraging. God help us!
You bet it is discouraging! I’d be worried if you weren’t discouraged. What’s going on in the Church is surely a trial for us. But we’ve gone through all of this before… not us personally, but the Church. We’ll make it. If it truly is too distressing for you then I recommend avoiding any Catholic news for awhile. You can’t let it disturb your peace which comes from God. You know what’s going on, and you know what you need to do. As you say, you’re doing it. So, now that you know the score, pray for the Church. Pray for the Pope. Offer rosaries for reparation of the damage done by wayward shepherds. But never, EVER let anyone rob you of faith in Christ!
Never! Thank you.
Weep. That is what the Blessed Virgin did at Calvary and the profanation of the Blessed Sacrament is no less a crime than the crucifixion of Jesus Christ. So weep and console the Sacred and Immaculate Hearts and ask them to help you suffer for the Church out of Divine Love.
It is priests like you that keep me planted in the Lord. Thank you father. I don’t know what going on in courage, but that is not good either. I feel like my best friend is leaving.
God help us!
Oh and listen to Fr. RP… definitely listen to him! 🙂
Yes listen to Fr. RP and also to Fr. Ripperger for some extra clarity too. If the Novus Ordo becomes an “open community” with morally indifferent and includes and welcomes those indifferent to Faith’s teachings, as the new priority, this will force the eyes open of a lot of Catholics who are living in denial. They will need to find the barque of Peter and perhaps that vision of St.John Bosco where it is moored to the Eucharist and the Blessed Virgin, give us some direction here. Marian Priests are most likely to be faithful Priests.
Amen…..
Climate change baloney? You are a very stupid person.
Remember to turn off your air conditioning and begin car pooling to fulfill the new eighth corporal and spiritual work of mercy–for the earth and climate change, you know.
Yeah… you can’t add new works of mercy… all things that can be done are included within those works and if caring for the climate doesn’t fit, guess what? It ain’t a work of mercy. I appreciate the humor though 🙂
Proper stewardship of the environment, material and immaterial, is indeed our responsibility due to the unique bestowal of the Divine Image and Likeness: however, because it is a STEWARDSHIP it belongs to the order of Justice not Mercy. Therefore it can never be a corporal, let alone, a spiritual work of mercy.
That being said, no aspect of material creation can demand the subordination of the Good of Man to it, rather it must always be subordinated to the Good of Man (who himself must always be subordinated to God) both in the present and as far as can be reasonably foreseen for the future.
Persons have primacy over Things; Ethics have primacy over Technology; and the Arts have primacy over the Sciences.
Of course, in the modern world the inverse of the above is what is occurring and is indeed the goal of the Evil One and his minions.
Actually I do that and have all my life but it’s through no personal virtue, when I was a teenager in the Navy I wanted more convenient transportation than buses and trains but I was leery of taking on the expense of vehicle ownership on the income of a very junior enlisted man. I was walking past a bike shop when inspiration hit and I went in and bought a 12 speed. Over the past 30 years I bet I’ve biked 5 times more miles than I’ve ever driven. As for AC I’ve always hated it, I’d rather run a fan any day. I’m guilty of contributing to climate change but not so much in those 2 categories. I sincerely apologize for my sinful behavior in calling the OP very stupid.
For the stupid/immoral climatist your exhalation of CO2 while riding your bike is the real problem underlying all of the others, therefor many (at least two thirds of the population of the World) exhalers must be eliminated for the good of the Environment (of course none of the proponents of this solution need to be eliminated, they are too important.)
That’s a purely foolish statement but actually I was mainly wondering if you are truly an ordained Catholic Priest?
You are absolved. Go forth and live in a commune with the greenie cult of Francis.
To quote Tom Berringer from the 1980’s movie “WarGames”: “I’d p#ss on a sparkplug if I thought it’d help any.”
And confess same if you continue to use it.
Who are you calling stupid??? I don’t believe in climate change but I know th Pope does and that was one of the problems. ☹️
Yes I apologize about the stupid crack, it was inappropriate.
I accept your apology. God bless.
I tried to defend him on some things thinking it was not really true, but I know what he thinks and it is not good.
The Schism happened fifty-plus years ago at Vatican II. All remains is the formal declaration from….?
No we still have a pope although a troubling one. I know what you are. You are heretic or a schismatic. Sevacante.
You should read all my posts. If you did so, you would understand why I say what I do. I am not what you label me. Nice try. The definition of a Sedevacantist is one believe we’ve not had a pope since the death of Pope St. Pius X. I do not believe that.
Be still and know that God is God and He is fully in charge and aware of all that is going on in His creation. Abandon yourself to Him and do not put your trust in princes, but in the Lord of Hosts. You don’t need to defend Pope Francis to anyone, let alone your husband. Pope Francis isn’t God nor is He the Catholic Faith.
Go to the Lord in the Tabernacle as often as possible and ask Him to help you console His most Sacred Heart for the many outrages and sacrileges that are taking place. I must do the same.
Lectio Divina, silent meditation/contemplation are an absolute necessity in this time of great personal and universal trial.
Thank you. God bless you!
Vatican Confirms: Pope Francis’ letter to Argentine bishops on Amoris Laetitia is authentic. Edward Pentin@EdwardPentin.
Also in L’Osservatore Romano: http://www.osservatoreromano.va/it/news/discernimento-e-carita-pastorale
The gauntlet has been thrown. What are the neo-Catholics going to do? They can no longer deny it.
“…Jesus loves you more than you will know.” (Not like that dumb St. John the Baptist)
Just wait. Francis will be calling (if he hasn’t already) St. John the Baptist a “pharisaical, judgmental doctor of the law” for his “hardness of heart” in refusing to acknowledge Herod’s marriage to Herodias and will lament how “misguided” the saint was in his willingness to die rather than compromise his principles.
Anyone notice a pattern here? This has come after ISIS threatened him. Hmmm …
Islam is not violent 😉
Why must they do positively everything in the most cowardly way possible? Why must we always scramble to verify the authenticity of everything? Why can’t they act like men and tell us to our faces?
Cowards are never men of God, for they are not righteous. They are generally not very virtuous as well.
That’s how the devil works.
The papal coat of arms is unpersuasive — look at how easily you were able to put it in the article. The color shift might be explained if an inkjet printer had been used, but it seems fairly severe. As to the signature, I would hope to see several known true signatures before leaping to any conclusion.
And for all that, I am inclined to believe that the document is real. But I caution that I have come to expect disappointing things from Pope Francis.
Francis has had the better part of a week to disavow this, but chooses to say nothing. Qui tacet consentire videtur.
The color shift can also come from the scanner used, which is far more likely. In addition, we don’t just have the document anymore. There’s 3 separate sources from the .va domain that confirm it to be real. So it’s real.
Even if it is… what then? Is the Church defectible? Sedevacantist heresy? Schism?
Those adulterers in “second marriages” will eat & drink their own judgement (1 Cor 11:29). Those in the hierarchy authorizing it take that responsibility on themselves and will answer before the throne of judgement.
Meanwhile, however flawed he is, the Holy Fathers needs our prayers. Keep the faith, propagate the faith… Recall:
Mt 23:6 “But I say unto you, that every idle word that men shall speak, they shall render an account for it in the day of judgment. ”
St. Paul in Acts 23:5 “For it is written: Thou shalt not speak evil of the prince of thy people. “
“Then what?”
The pope (for such he is beyond any reasonable doubt) has endorsed heresy in a private letter. It’s a long way from nothing, but it’s not the end of the world either. We have seen this before. What must happen now is that responsible bishops and other pastors competent to speak denounce the error. It will not do simply to ignore it and await the end of this miserable papacy, as too much scandal would attach to their silence and perceived cowardice and hypocrisy.
What then? Keep the faith. Pray for the Pope (for he surely needs them! His soul is in jeopardy!)… basically everything you said. Knowing what’s going on is important, if only to be kept from falling into error ourselves.
It’s bad news if it’s authentic. It’s also bad news if the Vatican have verified a fake. Knowingly.
Either way, they’re affirming the Argentinian document.
Mark the date well – October 31, 2016 in Lund the Lutherans will be given the okay to receive the Body of Christ and maybe even Herr Luther will be on his way to his own sainthood. After all we have a brotherhood since we all share a common baptism.
This would officially open the “supper of the Lord” to all.
Pray the Rosary for the True Pontiff and for the faithful and unfaithful clergy and laity.
It appears ground work is is being laid: Pope: The devil seeks to divide the Church at the root of unity | Vatican Radio
That is an extremely likely scenario as he already told a Lutheran woman to decide for herself
All this effort and bandwidth usage just to verify that Francis is the author of a letter supporting a document which supports AL in its most obvious reading from the outset!!!!????
Who are these halfwits who are still in denial about the situation?
Wasn’t it obvious the minute he gave Kasper the floor of the special consistory – UNOPPOSED?
Wasn’t it obvious when he stacked the synods with deviants?
Wasn’t it obvious when he put Baldasseri and Forte in charge of the synod?
Wasn’t it obvious when he went off in a screaming eeby-jeeby because so many bishops opposed him?
Wasn’t it obvious when he over-ruled the bishops’ vote in the Extraordinary synod to keep the most heretical paragraphs in the working document for the full synod?
Wasn’t it obvious when he sacked Burke and the book “Remaining in the Truth of Christ” was stolen from the synod particpants’ letter boxes?
Wasn’t it obvious when he linked the outcome of the synods with devolving more powers down to the bishops’ conferences – including power to determine doctrine?
Wasn’t it obvious when he wrote AL (ok, maybe he just signed it) and he put Ivegotlotsagaychums Schonborn in charge of the official interpretation?
Its been obvious where this has been going for the last 3 years – he’s even told us where it is going through his “magisterial interviews” with Scalfari. Wake up you dummies and take your blinkers off. The emperor is not wearing a beautiful suit of gold – he is stark bollock naked. What is the matter with you people? Do you think God will give you brownie points for sticking your heads in the sand?
The Truth shall set you free.
May God be with our Church and our holy Cardinals. It falls on their shoulders, which
they have been ordained with many graces to carry. And we, the laity must be with them, every step of the way. Our faith is the One True Faith! Let’s show the world now.
Holy Cardinals would have spoken-up long ago. They are all complicit! We literally have no leaders among those who have the power.
Indeed. It seems that we don’t have even one speaking out. St. John was on Calvary and now no one.
Here are some similar letters authorizing absolution and communion for notorious unrepentant sinners:
https://zippycatholic.wordpress.com/2015/01/21/the-grand-inquisitor-shows-pastoral-mercy-to-usurers/
think that the authenticity was never in discussion. What they said is that the letter was a provisional working paper sent to Francis, and that he strongly aproved it, as it shows.
Anyway, the confirmation of the whole thing is now in the official site of the Vatican, so forget it: it is authentic.
http://www.news.va/it/news/amoris-laetitia-lettera-del-papa-ai-vescovi-di-bue
http://www.osservatoreromano.va/it/news/discernimento-e-carita-pastorale
While I had no doubt in the first place, this certainty from a variety of sources raises a question for me. To what degree, if any, do we who have this knowledge have the responsibility to inform other faithful Catholics of the Pope’s duplicity and treachery to Christ?
Case in point, I have one very faithful Catholic friend, still firmly in the Novus Ordo camp unfortunately, who works as a youth minister, loves Church Tradition, has a master’s degree in theology… etc. He’s a faithful Catholic, working to serve the Church even though he could do something else and get far more money, trying to do his best. He’s defended Pope Francis on more than one occasion; many actually… Do I have an obligation to inform him? Some I know would be so scandalized that they may leave the Church so I don’t dare… but with those more firmly rooted in the faith, especially those with the mission of educating the young… do we need to tell them? I’ve been wrestling with this for a couple of months, but now with the evidence plain for everyone to see… help?
Et cognoscetis veritatem et veritas liberabit vos. (John 8:32)
Amen!
Yeeeeaaaaaahhhh you may be right…
There have been bad popes in the past. It’s just this generation’s turn. Surely your friend’s faith is not so fragile? Pray for the Pope.
And pray hard for the next one, his fidelity, valor and arrival.
Give it time, thought, and prayer. Pray for prudence in particular.
God bless!
Let the contortions at CMTV begin………
Don’t even bother. They’re not going to release any news about this. They didn’t when the censures against AL were made public, they didn’t with the video appeal to the Pope from LifeSiteNews, they endorsed AL on release… they won’t back down now. For all their harping on Bad Bishops they sure seem to give the Bishop of Rome a lot of slack…
If they let this slide, then you can rest assured that CMTV is little more than a vehicle to stoke Voris’ narcissism….he has no love for the Bride of Christ. I would also then have to question his alleged conversion from the homosexual lifestyle.
I’m already certain that it is such a vehicle, and (Lord forgive me if this is uncharitable or untrue) a vehicle for him to condemn and make amends for his old homosexual lifestyle in a public and imprudent way…
Do you suspect everyone who annoys you of committing sodomy?
Get a grip!
This is not about being “annoyed.” He has a past history of it. How sincere can he be about “saving souls” if he ignores this heresy of Francis? If he’s not sincere about that….why should I take him at his word on anything?
Do yourself a favor a review Ann Barnhardt’s “Diabolical Narcissism” video.
Voris admitted it quite publicly in a vortex
Watch this… I’m not accusing anyone of anything they have not accused themselves of. http://www.churchmilitant.com/video/episode/limiting-god
I should add that his decision to make this public is courageous, and his amendment of his life is wonderful and pleasing to God. That said, if what I indicated is true, he’s doing the wrong thing with this new lease on life. God love you.
I’m still waiting for the evidence Voris supposedly has that the Archdiocese of New York was going to out him, prompting his so-called preemptive strike. It’s been five months, and we’ve heard nothing. I suspect there was, in reality, an ulterior motive behind the whole scenario.
Yep!
I’d rather not speculate on that. While to accusation that NY was going to out him does make it public, I have no more information and his past, whatever it is, and his present actions have little if any bearing on me, and little or no real bearing on the future of the Church. The Pope proclaiming heresy is one thing; a wounded human with an axe to grind or guilt is entirely another and I will only pray for his personal sanctity, and the fruitful public witness.
What can I say? I have been reluctant to put “heresy” and “pope” in the same sentence. No, more, I have been VERY reluctant to do so. But when the pope challenges a traditional teaching that traces itself back to 1 Corinthians 11:29 and then, by implication at least, changes the Church’s ancient teaching about marriage that is based on the very words of Jesus, what recourse do I have?
I find myself largely in agreement with and sympathetic to several things posted here by Jafin. This is gut-wrenching stuff. A friend of mine, Catholic PhD & college prof, wrote me about this Argentinian letter affair today. He made a point I think worth repeating. Some members of his extended family suffered greatly in their lives and families because they chose to follow the hard teachings of Christ concerning marriage, divorce, and remarriage. Are their sacrifices now to be deemed foolish? A waste of effort? Count up all those Catholics who chose the same arduous path in the past and you have millions upon millions of faithful souls.
What liberals like Pope Francis always miss is the terrible unintended consequences of their actions. In the name of compassion here Francis distorts the clear teachings of Christ; he wants to help “wounded” souls in his care, so he “bends the rules just a bit.” But in doing so, he throws many other wounded souls “under the bus,” as current jargon would have it. He denigrates by implication the painful sacrifices of those who made or are now making the effort to abide one way or another by Jesus’ revelation to us. Some live as brother and sister; others live separately if possible. I know of a couple in my own parish who attend Mass every Sunday, but who pointedly refrain from ever receiving Communion because they have sought but not obtained a judgment of nullity for a previous marriage. Where’s the field hospital for these soldiers in Francis’ army?
The pope thus perpetrates an enormous injustice without knowing it, or perhaps without caring that he does. I leave aside here the appalling scandal his words and actions are causing.
This is, for me, the one of the deepest shames of Pope Francis other than the offense he gives to Christ and the Truth. He simply doesn’t see us. He is the so-called “Pope of the People” but he doesn’t see ordinary people
He doesn’t see my faithful in-laws who are confused and discouraged. He doesn’t see my non-Catholic family who are looking for Truth and not finding it. He doesn’t see faithful priests, catechists, and religion teachers who have to struggle to teach the Truth in spite of nearly universal error.
He doesn’t see the babies and elderly who die because he mostly ignores the Culture of Death. He doesn’t see the victims of Islam who die because he refuses to be a moral witness against it
He doesn’t see divorced couples who struggle to be faithful even when it demands heroism, and are deeply discouraged by his actions. Worst of all, he doesn’t see divorced people or homosexuals or all the other sinners who desperately need to repent and now don’t know how or from what.
The man can meet with George Clooney, Salma Hayek, and any number of secular, anti-Catholic persons and members of the death culture and still praise them to the highest heavens. Yet when it comes to Catholics who try to live the teachings of the Church in all their fullness, we are the butt of his sermons and fits of apoplectic anger.
Were you not aware that as our shepherd, Pope Francis should always be more gentle and welcoming with sinners, while harder on faithful Catholics so as to guide us to deeper conversion, or whatever other b.s. they’re spouting over at Alteia or the Register? Are you not a Catholic in the mold of Mark Shea and friends?
Reminds me of Obama that way. I’m always getting the feeling that the American president just doesn’t like most Americans all that much.
Where are the ridiculous charges of radical Catholic reactionaries now? I won’t be a bit surprised if the usual suspects double-down and claim the pope has the authority to green-light Holy Communion for those in public, objective mortal sin.
Ah, the twisted, gnarled logic of the Church of the New Order.
Oh, wow! I am so shocked and surprised! Not.
Now, the time has come. No more arguments. We have a heretic Pope. Let us pray for a remnant that will be faithful and pass on the faith.
Tanyi I agree with you but there was a part of me that suspected this for a long time (shortly after the election in 2013). Two points I would like to make – Francis – if he is indeed fulfilling Fatima (“pope” under the control of satan, formalizing the apostasy that already exists universally), La Salette (“Rome will lose the faith and become the seat of the antichrist” which isn’t Francis btw), and St Francis of Assisi (“not canonically elected”) then this just proves again and again the divine origin of the Catholic Church and the necessity for Catholics to pass through this trial (see CCC regarding the choice at the price of apostasy). Now this where Steve’s advice is sound – pope or no pope in Francis, we do not adjust our pursuit of holiness – just keep doing your duty in your state of life. Take heart in that this being willed by Christ (at least in his permissive will) and give thanks for preserving you in Faith and Grace. God bless and protect all of you and may the triumph of Our Lady’s Immaculate Heart be soon!
Wait, wait. It’s not eunough to say that it’s truth. Only if the Pope will confirm.
So, if I understand all of this correctly, the Pope has approved of people who are living in Adultery, and continuing to do so, to receive Holy Communion. Wait till I pass this on to all my divorced and remarried friends and family, who by the way are already receiving communion weekly.
Those same people get divorced, and then have the nerve to request the Church nullify their first marriage!
Next he will approve of sodomites receiving communion also. Only if they are truly sorry for how they are living. This pope has got me so confused, I no longer how to approach people to evangelize, or what I should tell them, for another dogma or doctrine could be changed by this pope tomorrow.
That’s the point. It is meant to confuse you so you don’t evangelise. Mind you, the Pope did say that proselytism is “profound nonsense”.
Do not be confused. He’s an evil man promoting evil and leading souls to hell while trying to hurt Christ. It’s not that complicated. The Church isn’t destroyed yet. When he contradicts, for example, Nicea, his words are empty. You don’t need to listen when he leads to sin.
You wrote: “Next he will approve of sodomites receiving communion also.” BINGO! Go to the Top of The Class. Yes, that’s what he (and his collaborators) are aiming for.
Thank you, Steve, for the update. I can already see and hear the next Council and future faithful Supreme Pontiff speaking into the microphone one after the other….ANATHEMA SIT!
I ask again: Just exactly who is in a state of schism/apostasy?
And Cardinal Burke will reply with “But it is not an official document, and the pope cannot change Church teaching….” BLAH, BLAH, BLAH…
Will any cardinal stand up to Francis and challenge him or his election?
This will certainly help separate the few sheep and shepherds from the goats
Again no surprise at all for those of us who have been watching. Prepare to be called heretics or schismatics or merciless because you don’t accept the lies.
It is a good thing to be slandered for Christ.
Meanwhile, over at the site below, we have a sophisticated argument to the effect that, concerning the pope’s letter, there’s nothing to see. Move on folks…
http://www.catholicculture.org/commentary/otc.cfm?ID=1413
I read it Johnny. Mirus claims “I have repeatedly made the point that the rules governing reception of Communion are disciplinary, not doctrinal”
He’s wrong of course. The necessity of being in a state of grace for the reception of the Eucharist is an Infallible Dogma (De Fide).
Good point. He was mixing bananas and apples; the Church can change things like the age for First Communion, but not what you mention. Mirus has softened the speak-no-evil-about-Francis rule at his site, but only because he absolutely had to. If he maintained the rigid prohibition once in vogue there, he’d have no readers after so many papal gaffes.
I’m sure the letter does in fact refect the Holy Father’s views but I am still suspicious of the signature. There are many points of difference. Also the size is completely unrealistic. Even if the letter was printed on A3 it would still be small but if it was on A4 he would have needed a specialist art pen to write that small. Try printing out sheet 2 of the PDF and see.
The Vatican seems to have authenticated it (Cannon212 linked article.)
If you go to Steve’s PDF link in his article and print out page 2 with the signature you will see what I mean. It would need a specialist pen and nib and probably a magnifier in order to write a signature that small. I’m just raising an unanswered question. Vatican is totally chaotic just now, nothing would surprise me.
The memory is mush, but – doesn’t writing small mean something related to both something cognitive and something psychological?
Ladies and Gentlemen, God has turned on the seatbelt sign due to spiritual turbulence. Please return to your pews and fasten your seatbelt, place your kneelers in the upright and locked position. In the event of the loss of sanctifying grace in the narthex, a priest will drop down from the ceiling above you to hear your confession and grant absolution. In the event the bottom falls out of the Catholic Church, the pew seat cushion embroidered with the Immaculate Heart of Mary can be used as a spiritual flotation device until the Rescue Party from Heaven arrives. From all of us in the hierarchy, enjoy your flight!