‘It is not permitted to be present at the sacred rites of infidels and heretics in such a way that you would be judged to be in communion with them’.
– St. Alphonsus Liguori, Theologia Moralis, Lib.5, Tract. 1, Cap. 3.
I don’t even know where to start.
Thanks to a tip from a reader this morning, I headed over to the official website of the Conference of Jesuit Provincials in Latin America and the Caribbean.
While there, I did some looking around. I followed the link to their Facebook page. It’s colorful. Colorful in a way that carries its own possibly troubling meaning these days:
The specific article I was alerted to was this one, about Fr. Arturo Sosa, the always controversial new Superior General of the Jesuits, who recently participated in a conference in Cambodia “between Buddhists and Christians who work for peace.”
He gave a homily, according to the article, on the themes of diversity, fear of difference, the “building of walls” that results from fear, and violence.
He then visited a Buddhist temple, where he addressed the 80 monks gathered there as follows:
Thank you so much for your time and the wisdom you shared today.
I have learned many things from you, and you have given me many things to think about and pray about. It is deeply consoling to see how we are united in our desire to promote peace and reconciliation in our world. It is also comforting to see how we share the belief that the path to peace begins from within, from the deep transformation of the inner person, from growth into detachment and loving-kindness.
I am grateful for what my Jesuit brethren do to promote dialogue with Buddhism here in Cambodia, whether at the level of academic exchange, prayer together or in the shared standard of living and common action at the service of the poor. Thank you for the meaningful and inspiring testimony of how you live our Jesuit mission of reconciliation.
Among the many things I have learned from Pope Francis, one is his insistence on the importance of creating a culture of encounter. He uses this phrase all the time. He believes that in our divided world, where some want to build walls, what we must do is to promote the encounter, without fear and respect, people who meet people, listening deeply and respectfully to each other, building relationships and friendships.
Thank you for this meeting event this afternoon, which has enriched me, and I hope it will bear fruit in service.
[Translation by Google]
It was an entirely pedestrian address. Sanitized. No mention of Jesus Christ. No indication of Fr. Sosa’s desire to bring souls to the fullness of Truth, as so many of his forebears in the Society of Jesus were known for. As I finished reading through it, in fact, I couldn’t help but think of St. Francis Xavier, the apostle to Asia. One of the first Jesuits, he worked tirelessly in India, Malaysia, Japan, and had he not fallen ill before reaching the mainland, would have become a missionary to China as well. The Catholic Encyclopedia says of St. Francis Xavier:
It is truly a matter of wonder that one man in the short space of ten years (6 May, 1542 – 2 December, 1552) could have visited so many countries, traversed so many seas, preached the Gospel to so many nations, and converted so many infidels. The incomparable apostolic zeal which animated him, and the stupendous miracles which God wrought through him, explain this marvel, which has no equal elsewhere. The list of the principal miracles may be found in the Bull of canonization. St. Francis Xavier is considered the greatest missionary since the time of the Apostles, and the zeal he displayed, the wonderful miracles he performed, and the great number of souls he brought to the light of true Faith, entitle him to this distinction.
What the Jesuits of 2017 present us with instead in the example of their leader, Fr. Sosa, is the following image, with a bizarre caption that appears when one holds their mouse over the photo:
If you can’t read it, it says, “Father Sosa is officially the first Superior Jesuit in Buddhist Baptism.” This is a rough machine translation of the caption written into the code of the page, which reads, in Spanish, “Padre Sosa es oficialmente el primer Superior Jesuita en bautizarse budista.” More clearly put: “Father Sosa is officially the first Jesuit Superior to baptize himself Buddhist.”
Now, I have no idea what it means to “baptize oneself Buddhist.” Probably because it doesn’t. Mean anything, that is. Buddhists don’t baptize. Buddhists don’t really even believe in God. As Carl Olson and Anthony Clark explained in this piece on Catholicism and Buddhism from Ignatius Insight:
It is sometimes said that Buddhism is atheistic. Yet Buddhism is not interested in the question of God, so it is more accurate to describe it as agnostic. Buddhism “works” whether or not there is a God. A Buddhist allows others to believe in a God or gods, but such beliefs are merely convenient means to the final end, which has nothing to do with a God or gods. “God is neither affirmed nor denied by Buddhism,” wrote Merton in Mystics and Zen Masters, “insofar as Buddhists consider such affirmations and denials to be dualistic, therefore irrelevant to the main purpose of Buddhism, which is emancipation from all forms of dualistic thought.”
It was the common teaching of the Church before the heady days of ecumenism and interfaith mania following the Second Vatican Council that Catholics were to avoid the majority of ecumenical prayer and of course, interfaith gatherings.
In the excellent catechetical text, My Catholic Faith: A Manual of Religion, we read:
How does a Catholic sin against faith?
A Catholic sins against faith by infidelity, apostasy, heresy, indifferent to them, and by taking part in non-Catholic worship.
We may lose our faith by: (a) not learning well the doctrines of the church; space (b) willfully doubting trues that have been revealed to the church; (c) reading books and other literature against our religion; space (d) space attending assemblies of people who are opposed to our religion; and space (e) space neglecting the practice of our religion.
And further:
Persons who do not believe in Christianity as a divinely revealed religion, whether they have been baptized or not, are commonly referred to as quote infidels”. Infidelity is refusal to believe in anything that cannot be perceived with the senses, or comprehended with the understanding.
But is it not utterly reasonable to have faith in Almighty God Who knows much more than we can ever hope to know and Who can do things beyond our understanding? It is necessary that we serve God in the way He requires, not in the way it pleases us to do so. For this reason we must practice the religion revealed by God, and avoid making up our own religions according to our wins and innumerable fancies. Buddhists, Mohammedans, Hindus, Jews, and pagans, are infidels. As explained, Christians can also become infidels.
[…]
Why does a Catholic sin against faith by taking part in non-Catholic worship?
A Catholic sins against faith by taking part in non-Catholic worship, because he thus professes belief in a religion he knows is false.
1.) It is wrong to be present at Protestant or Jewish services even when we do not participate in them, because such services are intended to honor God in a manner he does not wish to be honored in. If he instituted the church of his own he must wish to be honored in the ways of that church. In addition we then give bad example, and expose ourselves to the danger of losing our faith.
When necessary, for social obligations, a Catholic may be present at a non-Catholic wedding or funeral, but he must not participate in the services. In no case may he attend other services of non-Catholic churches, such as the installation of their ministers, sermons, etc.
Now, look again at the picture above. Does Fr. Sosa appear to be “taking part in non-Catholic worship”?
It certainly does.
And now the members of his own order see nothing wrong in saying that he has “baptized himself a Buddhist.”
Those of you who’ve been paying attention for a long time will no doubt be able to point to other similar examples in the not-too-distant past, perhaps most notably the so-called “ecumenical” prayer gatherings at Assisi, under the leadership of Pope John Paul II. Converts and those who’ve come recently to study the Church’s traditional teachings may not be aware of these things. For the sake of space, and my own sanity, I won’t begin listing them here. An exhaustive treatment would span many pages.
This kind of thing has to stop. As I’ve written before, as Catholics, we can’t be indifferent to indifferentism. And though we may be tempted to say, “What’s the big deal, this happens all the time now!”, we should resist that temptation. It’s always a big deal. It’s a big deal that we’ve become so cynical that it barely raises an eyebrow these days.
At times like these, I reflexively reach for the Act of Consecration of the Human Race to the Sacred Heart of Jesus (Pope Pius XI), which I’ve shared with you before:
Most sweet Jesus, Redeemer of the human race, look down upon us humbly prostrate before Thine altar. We are Thine, and Thine we wish to be; but, to be more surely united with Thee, behold each one of us freely consecrates himself today to Thy most Sacred Heart.
Many indeed have never known Thee; many too, despising Thy precepts, have rejected Thee. Have mercy on them all, most merciful Jesus, and draw them to Thy sacred Heart. Be Thou King, O Lord, not only of the faithful who have never forsaken Thee, but also of the prodigal children who have abandoned Thee; grant that they may quickly return to Thy Father’s house lest they die of wretchedness and hunger.
Be Thou King of those who are deceived by erroneous opinions, or whom discord keeps aloof, and call them back to the harbor of truth and unity of faith, so that there may be but one flock and one Shepherd.
Be Thou King of all those who are still involved in the darkness of idolatry or of Islamism, and refuse not to draw them into the light and kingdom of God. Turn Thine eyes of mercy towards the children of the race, once Thy chosen people: of old they called down upon themselves the Blood of the Savior; may it now descend upon them a laver of redemption and of life.
Grant, O Lord, to Thy Church assurance of freedom and immunity from harm; give peace and order to all nations, and make the earth resound from pole to pole with one cry: “Praise be to the divine Heart that wrought our salvation; to it be glory and honor for ever.” Amen.
And please pray for Fr. Sosa. He leads the deeply troubled order of which our own pope is a member.
As one of the readers on the other blog pointed out, SJ in Sosa’s case stands for- Son of Judas!
How can one be so oblivious to the fact he is helping capsize the bout? This can only be done on purpose. But never the less, let’s double down on prayers and sacrifice for our enemies, even if they happen to be Superior Generals.
St. Ignatius of Loyola, ora pro nobis!
First to comment!
This kind of thing CANT stop. Ecumenism is the foundation of the religion. You might as well ask Islamists to stop beheading people, hehe…
The ecumaniacs equate orthodox Catholics with Isis. Maybe they can dialogue with Isis and see how an interfaith prayer service goes. They could be “baptized into Islam.”
That might end up as a ‘baptism of blood.’
Are you trolling?
Sounds like a “Novus Ordo Watch” follower. They call us “the Novus Ordo Religion”.
I’m aware… thought I’d give a chance to respond here though.
I don’t think so, why?
Are you saying the foundation of Catholicism is ecumenism, or are you referring to some sort of “Novus Ordo” religion? Just to head off any potential pitfalls, you might want to familiarize yourself with the comment policy here. You can find a link to it right before the comment boxes. You seem to be hinting at something like sedevacantism or the like, and our comment policy targets that specifically. Here’s the relevant section:
If that is where you’re heading, well, we might entertain the conversation for a little bit, but we’re pretty familiar with the use of the ban hammer. If that’s not where you’re heading then I look forward to your clarification and whatever conversation follows!
One of the foundations of the new religion calling itself Catholicism is ecumenism. Pretty Lady is spot on. Nothing that she has written suggests sedevacantism.
A friend of mine joined the Jesuits. He’s a brilliant and orthodox man, unfortunately from San Francisco. He had to endure living in a Jesuit house in San Francisco where most of the priests were gay and went around calling themselves by female names. They called themselves the lavender mafia. Days typically ended in drinking copious amounts of wine after dinner and you know the rest. My friend wouldn’t spend much time with them and when it came time for his ordination, after 12 years of training as a seminarian, he was denied his ordination because, according to his superiors, he “was not intimate enough with them.” They were a bunch of sodomites; he was orthodox. And they didn’t want him in their ranks. He appealed to the Superior General and was denied, no surprise. Cardinal Dolan and Pope Benedict were of no help to him either. So, he took the mandatory three years off (shortened to two by Cardinal Dolan) and then entered the diocesan seminary all over again, in the greatest fidelity to his vocation one could imagine. He’s a saintly and heroic man and will be a great soul in the Church. But the Jesuits….May God have mercy on them all. It’s heartbreaking what they have become.
That is an appalling story. The cult of sodomy must be extracted from The Church. Prayer said for your friend.
They are so numerous and so deeply entrenched in the culture of the Church I don’t know who would lead the extraction you hope for. Homosexuals have infested every element of society from your local state legislature to the public schools system in every state to every department of the Federal government, including the military to every level of Catholic hierarchy to the very top level of the Vatican. No one but Our Savior can rescue the world from these people.
I wish that Project Veritas guy would do a video to expose priests like this.
James O’Keefe
I understand that he is a fan of Chesterton. So, maybe he would be willing to bust these sodomite clergy folks.
Great idea!
When I was in the convent I spent a great deal of time with young Jesuit seminarians because the spiritual director was also a novice master. They tended to be either pretty traditional or way off the deep end. Your story breaks my heart and also explains why so many catholics do not know what our church really teaches.
To be ‘intimate with them’ is a path to hell.
Cannot be intimate with sodomites when you are intimate with God.
Your friend is on the path with the narrow gate. May God bless and richly reward him. He will make a fine priest.
Sobbering, isn’t it, to know that Jorge Bergoglio is one of them?
Will Sosa be fast-tracked to the ‘red hat’? Or would that convention be set aside in his case. I can believe anything about this thoroughly rotten pontificate. It would surprise me not in the least if Sosa is Bergoglio’s preferred successor. And in order to be the well-rounded ‘pope’ after Bergoglio’s heart, maybe he will prepare himself by going to Africa and baptizing himself an animist; go and immerse himself in the Ganges and declare himself a Hindu, and to Mecca and formally submit himself Allah and Sharia law. Not only are we “all protestants now! We are soon to be “all pagans now!”
“I feel as though I could believe anything about this pontificate.”
The only thing you are not allowed to believe in polite company is that it isn’t one.
And frightening.
Sobbering or slobbering?
‘Sobering.’ As in ‘the effects of being sober.’
Yes, Winslow, thanks for pointing out the obvious ….
Well, you didn’t include it with your two options. Just trying to help.
I was commenting on it …. but never mind … !
Who said our American friends don’t get subtlety?
It were me!
Pope Francis once said that he doesn’t watch the news, read newspapers, or get on the internet. I think the Holy Father is just clueless in a bubble like so many of our clergy. He just knows what he is told.
I can be persuaded about many things concerning Jorge Bergoglio, but naivete and innocence of purpose are not among them.
I don’t think so. In his 4+ years at the helm he has shown himself to be a sly, devious and treacherous snake in the grass. He’s not too smart, I’ll give you that, but clueless he is not.
…And we wonder why there is a vocations crisis… only sex freaks need apply…
Yes. …And the Jesuits have made a spelling mistake on their Facebook homepage. I’ve made the necessary correction here: https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/54141b4b80e7a229be8d063fa26c64668d831ed349f87e35f69c81e5c2599d1e.jpg
Those SJ sodomites have surrendered, no longer resisted to temptation and chosen evil and end up making themselves worse than beasts in doing intrinsic evil acts. Repent as fast as you can.
Just FYI, using the term “sodomites” to describe gay people is wholly uncharitable and counter to our pastoral teaching on how to treat our LGBT brothers and sisters.
The other funny thing is this story sounds eerily close to the story of someone I know. What I bet he didn’t tell you (if it is, in fact, the same person) is that this former-Jesuit-now-diocesan priest carried on an inappropriate romantic relationship with one of the women for whom he was spiritual director. It lasted far beyond his scholastic years. It was, frankly, sexual predation. He constantly promised to leave his vocation to marry her, and it took many years for her to realize that his promise was nothing more than a rouse to keep her emotionally dependent on him. He is far from saintly and far from heroic, and the Jesuits were absolutely right in denying him ordination. May God have mercy on him and on you for this abhorrent post.
Calling those who suffer same sex attraction is not charitable and doesn’t help them. The are not “gay” in the sense of the word. They have seerious problems. They ought to be treated charitably, but charity is not in conflict with the truth. The most charitable thing to do is to to help people avoid sin and the occasoins of sin. Don’t forget that the first spiritual work of mercy is “To admonish sinners”. Is that uncharitable?
Your first sentence doesn’t make sense. Regardless, the way people here are talking about homosexuals is counter to our Catholic faith. Truth does not excuse hateful language. Period. You all know this, yet you all choose to disregard it, apparently due to your own elevated senses of righteousness. Pride is also a capital sin, and this thread is dripping with it. You people sure are obsessed with other people’s sex lives. How much time do you spend on the internet posting about the sins of greed, racism, unjust social structures, poverty, and abuse of the world’s natural resources?
Agreed about the use of the word, “sodomite,” to refer to homosexual men. Thank you.
The ecumaniacs have been hammering away for so long that this type of what used to be called a scandal, isn’t even a blip on the radar. Recently I brought this concern up to a priest and he laughed. He said if it’s sin to pray with other denominations then he must be sinning every time he has to go to an ecumenical prayer service. This is the sad truth, many priests have been taught that this interfaith prayer is normal and good. Priests are of course human beings, so naturally they will be a product of their formation in seminary and society as a whole. Just like all of us. I remind myself this so I won’t be so quick to judge. So sad to witness much of the Church forego The Great Commission given to Her by Christ Himself. The Apostles and the saints knew the mission. And they persevered despite all tribulation and hostility. St Peter certainly didn’t dialogue and pray together with the pagan cults nor the cult of the emperor. Of course St Peter didn’t do so because he was no ecumaniac. We must pray very much for the clergy. May the Lord dispel all the darkness and confusion from The Holy Catholic Church.
Suppress the Jesuits.
LOL! Who is going to do that with one of them on the Chair of Peter?
Exactly, Winslow Old Boy, have you no appreciation for irony?
I do when the comment is structured to indicate irony. If there is something in your message to indicate irony, please point it out to me. I missed it. Thanks.
You have the last word.
When will discipline return to the Catholic Church?
When everyone stops going to the Novus Ordo. That would be most of the job.
The late Malachi Martin recommended withholding funds from the collection plate. I would rather strong-arm the hierarchy that way than abandon the Church.
By going to the Roman Rite of Mass, you are doing anything BUT abandoning the Church!
If it’s available to you, I agree; going to the Roman Rite of the Mass is itself not abandoning the Church.
But to suggest that somneone who attends the Novus Ordo—particularly because it is the only form of the Mass available, because he cares enough to receive the Eucharist—is thereby somehow lost, is itself an abandonment of the Church.
Someone may point out that you cannot make a judgement that someone has left the Church unless there is an official declaration of the fact from the hierarchy.
I wasn’t speaking of formal apostasy. I’m speaking of the nearly
universal attitude and impulse I’ve noticed in the short week-and-a-half’s time since I first visited this website, to denigrate so-called Novus Ordo Catholics.
One person asks me, rather cynically, whether I’m not, by any chance “one of those Novus Ordo Catholics”? Another accused me of being “a stealth defender of the [Novus Ordo] status quo…”
For a year, now, I’ve been familiar with Steve Skojec’s podcasts; But only recently did I find the daily articles with a Comment section.
If this is, by default, a predominantly SSPX website, that would be one thing, however unanticipated. If, on the other had, it is an officially SSPX-sponsored website, exclusively for SSPX Catholics, then it isn’t I who am practicing stealth. There is no indication of that fact anywhere on the 1P5 website.
I represent no faction. I defend the Catholic Church I’ve known for 70 years.
I concede that your own willingness to relocate a thousand miles to live by what you believe is thoroughly admirable. But as I’ve mentioned in other postings there is only a single SSPX parish in all of Alaska, in Anchorage.
How do the Catholic Inupiat’s living on Little Diomede Island (population 110) in the Bering Straits find access to a traditional Mass? What realistic advice do you offer to them?
Again, I defend the Church, period. But, yeah, maybe by default I am a “Novus Ordo Catholic,” I guarantee you, though, there is nothing whatsoever stealthy about it.
The leaning of this blog is towards the FSSP, but it does not condemn the SSPX as schismatic, just irregular.
It’s rowdy people in the comments box giving their own opinions which the moderstors allow to have discussions – to a point. The site doesn’t endorse every comment they allow to remain. They like to see the ideas worked out in intelligent debate. So, the articles are official 1P5, but the comments are made by a broader range of people.
I dont know what to do or what advice to give to those isolated people. They have been cut off from the apostolic rite of mass that they are rightly meant to have.
I would stay home and do an extra rosary and watch and follow along with a webcast of a trad mass if I could. I believe we are not permitted to endanger our faith by going to a rite that does not conform to tradition.
Cardinal Ottaviani said “the Novus Ordo represents, both as a whole and in its parts, a striking departure from the theology of the Mass as it was defined in session XXII of the Council of Trent.”
Well, I’m not particularly intimidated by the rowdies; just taken off guard. I can hold my own.
But here is my dilemma:
“When will discipline return to the Catholic Church?”
“When everyone stops going to the Novus Ordo.” [sounds like an abandonment]
“Why not withhold funds instead of abandoning the Church.”
“…going to the Roman Rite Mass is anything BUT abandoning the Church.”
“…to suggest that the only way to return to an authentic Church is to abandon the Novus Ordo is, in fact, to abandon Her.”
“you cannot make a judgement that someone has left the Church unless there is an official declaration of the fact from the hierarchy.”
“I wasn’t speaking of formal apostasy…only of an attitude and impulse.”
“…we are not permitted to endanger our faith by going to a rite that does not conform to tradition.”
Has that been officially declared by the hierarchy? If so, where? And why would that same hierarchy continue to permit and foster a rite that doesn’t conform to tradition?
If the hierarchy is in error in on something so important as allowing the Novus Ordo, of what good are any of its official declarations?
We are going to get into very deep water if we continue this discussion here. The 1P5 comment box moderators are open to legitimate discussion, much more so than others like The Remnant and the Voris blog, but they also have their limits. I can answer them, but I can’t answer them here.
I’ve been plodding away for several years trying to find out what happened to the Catholic Church, the Church I love and trust more than anything in the world. I didn’t like what I found, and there were several distressing facts that came to light, but when the emotions cooled off, the facts were still there. We are in the very worst crisis the Church has ever faced. The apostasy since Vatican II and the introduction of the new mass is almost universal. There has never been anything like this in two thousand years.
Your last three paragraphs contain questions which are excellent. They are spot on. I know, because I asked them myself. They made me lose lots of sleep. They lead down a very deep rabbit hole. Make up your mind that you will accept the truth no matter where it leads. Like the 1999 film The Matrix, you can take “the blue pill” and go back to thinking everything is the same as it ever was, or you can take “the red pill” and start the investigation.
I suspect we’re essentially in agreement. I began my own investigation decades ago; but I guess I’m much more concerned with moral reform than with liturgical reform.
I suppose it’s somewhat like my attitude to climate change. I don’t care a rat’s farthing about global warming. I truly believe that if each of us were to humbly and prayerfully pursue personal holiness, in that very process we would come to adopt those sentiments of solicitude for our own surroundings that constitute the entirety of our responsibilities as individual stewards of the environment.
Similarly, while I do care about the liturgy, I have the same underlying belief that if priests become sufficiently holy, the Mass will by that very fact be returned to traditional form. Whereas, returning the Mass to the traditional Latin rite will not guarantee holier priests.
Just one man’s gut opinion.
That’s an interesting summary. I think you are right on many points. I would say though that morality is more of an individual responsibility. Each must apply the Church’s teaching to his own circumstances each day.
The liturgy in the other hand is the public and official worship of the Catholic Church offered to the Divine Majesty. It is universal, not individual. If we get the first three Commandments in order as the Mystical Body of Christ, it should have a great effect on the individual lives of the members to carry out the other seven. Just my opinion, based on what I’ve learned.
They bloody well need denigrating, because a majority of them – according to published surveys – are not only not Catholics, they cannot use the word “Christian” in any sense about themselves.
Those who support contraception, abortion, same sex “marriage” and now euthanasia are PAGANS. And that’s what the surveys say they believe in.
And who says such people are pagans? The Fathers of the Church, that’s who.
As a putative Novus Ordo Catholic I will tell you that If you believe there is a necessary connection between going to a Novus Ordo Mass and supporting “contraception, abortion, same sex ‘marriage’ or euthanasia” then you are dead wrong.
Our Pastor does not support those things; I do not support them nor do the faithful men I associate with at Immaculate Conception parish.
It is a contemptible and outrageous accusation.
Surveys indeed. Like the ones that showed Hillary Clinton umpteen points ahead,the night before the election no doubt. They never surveyed me or they would have gotten an earful.
Not a direct connection – but an indirect one, yes; definitely. The Novus Ordo religion is one that takes the world and its values into its arms.
Night and day, oil and water, chalk and cheese.
When YOU know what the alternative is – you clearly do not, yet – then we can usefully talk.
A new religion! Really.
Seems Mike is right, you’re not talking about abandoning the Church. Your claim is even more astounding—that the Church has abandoned all Novus Ordo Catholics—priests and laity alike.
All of our priests—validly ordained by validly ordained bishops in an unbroken chain back to the time of Christ…suddenly had the graces of Holy Orders lift themselves up from their shoulders and those graces just wafted over to and landed on the shoulders of the priests who pray the Latin Mass, for a double portion like Elias got from Elijah.
Sorry but as long as they intend what the Church has always intended—the transubstantiation of bread and wine into the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Our Lord—it is accomplished. That is the very heart of the Mass.
Furthermore, since I had myself consecrated to Our Lady 50 years ago—and have renewed it twice since—I doubt I’m quite as lost as you think. Sinner though I am, She is absolutely and unfailingly faithful and has not left Her sons and daughters to be devoured by the evil pervading the Church.
Plenty of us Novus Ordo Catholics love Her with an unquenchable love. So you might want to check out the nearest Legion of Mary praesidium—
Devotion to Mary. “Let a man but try it for himself, and his surprise at the graces it brings with it and the transformations it causes in his soul, will soon convince him of its otherwise almost incredible efficacy as a means for the salvation of men, and for the coming of the Kingdom of Christ.” -de Montfort
—then, as you say, we can usefully talk.
You are in the middle of Alaska somewhere; and by your own admission have come to these questions only recently. I suggest you do a great deal more reading before you comment.
Start with these:
A Letter to Confused Catholics – Archbishop Lefebvre
Iota Unum – here you are, you don’t even have to buy it. http://www.sspxasia.com/Documents/books/Iota_Unum/index.htm
“When offered two goods, always choose the greater good; when presented with two evils, always choose the lesser evil—and always maintain as much of your innocence as possible.”
Before I came to live “in the middle of Alaska somewhere”—some 20 years ago—I lived in upstate New York. I often visited the Abbey of the Genesee, a Trappist monastery some 30 miles south of Rochester, in Piffard, New York.
Such was the advice that Brother Lewis would often give to the men on retreat there.
I thought I explained, but you’ve misread me. By my “own admission” when I said that certain information was new to me, I was referring to the depth of pedophile depravity I’ve learned of through recent reports on InfoWars.
As far as the Novus Ordo business goes, it was some 40 years ago that I read Michael Davies (“Liturgical Revolution” and “Cranmer’s Godly Order”) and some 15 years ago that I read Father Wathen’s take on the New Mass in “The Great Sacrilege.”
I found them compelling, but not decisive. I might be an unconvinced Catholic, hardly a confused Catholic.
I have no problem at all with anyone preferring and, if it’s conveniently available to them, attending the traditional Latin Mass. But whereas you see it as a matter of choosing good over evil, I see it as choosing a greater good (the Latin Mass) over a lesser good (the Novus Ordo Mass).
I simply deny that, having drunk “Kool-Aid,” I’m headed to Hell because I wont abandon the faith community of people I love, here in Fairbanks, in order to save my own skin, so to speak, by moving to Anchorage near the only SSPX parish in the state.
I’m not at all confused. I just don’t believe Our Lady—Who brought me to Alaska to begin with—brought me here to my peril.
Church has abandoned no-one. The heretics, apostates and atheists in possession of the Church have abandoned everyone, God first.
Do your reading.
Do my reading? I suspect I read with far more attentiveness than you display in your responses. I also suspect I’ve been at it far longer than you.
Maybe if you presented your beliefs in a way that made them more attractive you’d have a shot at convincing others.
As it is, I’m happy enough with my own understanding of what I’m called on to do.
“Learn things.”
Fair enough! As you wish.
Of course, I give them enough to keep the AC running and put other donations in the donation boxes hopefully thus keeping it out of the hands of theologically perverted men higher up the chain.
FSSP has an increase in vocations to the priesthood. They’re worthy of our support and they pray for us.
No!
No. What?
It would at least be a good start.
I already can’t find a seat at my TLM, if they all leave at once there won’t be anywhere to sit but I would glady stand up against the wall and kneel on the hard tile to get some of them over to the true mass.
The Church cannot lose any of her attributes. There is a strange new religion – which is much more popular than Catholicism at the moment – doing the rounds. It is devoid of this discipline you yearn for.
The laity has to figure out someway to protest and get rid of these people. All the Bishops are complete and total cowards. I mean not one Bishop can speak plainly about the situation.
I think I recall Bishop Athanasius Schneider speak clearly as to the errors of modern ecumenism once… I don’t recall where though.
Yes, but the modern errors of ecumenism (heresies, apostasies) come from the heart of Vatican II itself. You can only go so far in criticism before you will find yourself at odds with the Council and by extension, the CCC. What’s a son of the Council going to do?
That’s true, what is he going to do? You read stuff in the Council documents like “the muslims/jews adore one worshipful God with us”, this is of course a complete LIE since neither believe in the God of the new testament and you read the CCC andi it’s the same, word for word from the Council document. Both need to be torn up and tossed onto the fire and revert back to the previous Catechism.
I have here a Baltimore Catechism on my desk and that is all any Catholic would need to learn the faith backwards and forwards, more could be added later but the essential truths are all right there unchanged since forever.
I never said they don’t come from there, and there are some serious problems with the CCC. But the Council never defined doctrine, the council never issued anathemas. It is just a series of strong pastoral suggestions and opinions of the council fathers. For example, Lumen Gentium tries to make a statement about what Muslims believe, and this phrase made its way into the CCC. The Church has no authority to define the beliefs of another religion except to say that it is not the truth. Bishop Schneider himself has suggested that there needs to be an accompanying document produced by the Ordinary Magisterium of the pope that should be read along with the Vatican II documents to clarify ambiguities and correct the errors that exist in the council’s documents. We’ve talked about this before haven’t we? 😛
Anyways, Bishop Schneider seems to be the only prelate that really gets what’s going on. The Dubia Cardinals are onto the scent, but haven’t followed the thread far enough.
You know, the newchurch has a funny way of dealing with these mere suggestions.
A gathering of, what, 3000 bishops; with the Pope presiding; at a general Council; held in St Peter’s Basilica; over a three year period; issuing sixteen documents.
The effect has produced a new theological perspective, produced a Mass that breaks with what the Church believes, a new code of canon law, a new catechism, new rites of sacraments, new official policy, and new official interactions with non-Catholic religions. And this was all from a non-binding, admittedly erroneous/heretical , non-official (therefore not from the Catholic Church) “pastoral” meeting in the 60’s?
Lucky they are off the hook from causing the worst apsotasy in the history of the Church, because of the little technicality known as the “only pastoral” clause.
If they didn’t mean for anyone to take it seriously, then why didn;t they just say so, instead of implementing the greatest revolution against the Faith that history has ever seen?
Did Paul VI mean to make every document, and the whole council binding? Let’s see:
“Each and every one of the things set forth in this Decree has won the consent of the fathers. We, too, by the Apostolic Authority conferred on us by Christ, join with the venerable fathers in approving, decreeing, and establishing these things in the Holy Spirit, and we direct that what has thus been enacted in synod [council] be published to God’s glory… I, Paul, Bishop of the Catholic Church.”
This was at the end of each document of the Council.
He closed the whole Council with these words in 1965, December 8:
“At last all which regards the holy ecumenical council has, with the help of God, been accomplished and all the constitutions, decrees, declarations and votes have been approved by the deliberation of the synod and promulgated by us. Therefore we decided to close for all intents and purposes, with our apostolic authority, this same ecumenical council called by our predecessor, Pope John XXIII, which opened October 11, 1962, and which was continued by us after his death.
We decided moreover that all that has been established synodally is to be religiously observed by all the faithful, for the glory of God and the dignity of the Church and for the tranquillity and peace of all men. We have approved and established these things, decreeing that the present letters are and remain stable and valid, and are to have legal effectiveness, so that they be disseminated and obtain full and complete effect, and so that they may be fully convalidated by those whom they concern or may concern now and in the future; and so that, as it be judged and described, all efforts contrary to these things by whomever or whatever authority, knowingly or in ignorance be invalid and worthless from now on.
Given in Rome at St. Peter’s, under the [seal of the] ring of the fisherman, Dec. 8, on the feast of the Immaculate Conception of the Blessed Virgin Mary, the year 1965, the third year of our pontificate.”
http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Paul06/p6closin.htm
Whether it was “only pastoral advice” or not is debatable, considering the above. There’s a popular narrative that says it did not intend to teach, but only advise. Is this right, or is it part of a greater swindle?
Will the efforts of good Catholics who want to play a part in the restoration of the Church be accomplished by accepting Vatican II and its effects, and trying to make them good, or by rejecting them outright and holding fast to tradtion?
It is on the 21st July 2017 blog of Rorate Caeli!
That’s another way.
I haven’t read that yet so I’m fairly certain he’s said it elsewhere. That said, I’m going to have to head over and read that!
The Remnant is one way Bishop Schneider speaks to the world.
The Remnant, Rorate Caeli, OnePeterFive on occasion, and even Church Militant, though CM seems to have distanced themselves from His Excellency.
I haven’t read CM in at least a year. Not a cult follower. I read the others regularly. They’re my lifeline.
Me too. Well… not the Remnant. Not sure why, but I don’t go there very often.
I subscribe to the Remnant newspaper. Good red meat for the masses.
For the mid-West American masses. Not for anyone else really.
I live in Eastern Massachusetts, Comrade. I read every issue cover to cover. What’s your objection to The Remnant? It is in agreement with everything you post that I read. Solidly Catholic.
It’s my belief that Michael Matt has, under severe financial and other pressures, lost it a bit. I am thinking of several issues in saying that. The comboxes there are low on intellectual content which switches some people off. It doesn’t really work for the non-mid Westerner; certainly not for the non-American. But each to his own. The Remnant does a fine job insofar as it goes.
“…lost it a bit…” is vague, as is “…thinking of several issues in saying that…” I can’t comment on what is in the Remnant comboxes because I don’t read anything but the newspaper. They may well be populated with the innocent and childlike. We need more of those. There are plenty of the wise and learned around.
Matt is a bit of a hick and some of his rhetoric grates on me, but he’s a good writer and is on the front lines in defending the Faith; he has given his life to the effort. I can’t say that about myself. There are, no doubt, financial pressures, but we can say that about First Things and most other periodicals in that genre. It comes with the territory.
All that said, he’s on the Catholic side of Bergoglio and does not cease slamming him. He publishes all the public statements of Bishop Schneider and Cardinal Burke and Hilary White is one of his regular contributors. He reprints the writing of Archbishop Lefebvre which alone is an invaluable contribution to the education of today’s uneducated Catholics. In light of all that, damning him with faint praise is a bit unfair, but you’re certainly entitled to your opinion.
Why not? What do you have against it? Solidly Catholic.
Funny that Sosa has his hands clasped in the traditional prayer posture. He’d never do that in a Catholic Church, of course. He had to go to a Buddhist temple to do it.
Does he know that Francis doesn’t like that posture? The Pope once pulled apart the hands of an altar boy who had them piously joined together. Maybe it’s OK if you’re with Buddhists.
Yes, that little video clip was the beginning of the end for any respect for Francis’ Catholicism.
Really sad to see this but well done for not getting bitter towards Fr Sosa and all the Jesuit religious, they all urgently need our prayers.
I was a Tibetan Buddhist for over 20 years and many Catholics are attracted to this particular tradition. Many because of all the rituals. You are correct, there is no Buddhist baptism. When asked about whether there was a God or not, the Buddha replied, I do not know, I have come to end suffering, that’s my path. Buddhism is considered a philosophy more than anything. It’s also based on relativism which can be very tricky to say the least. I eventually found my way back to the Catholic Church and would say I am pretty traditional. It’s okay to respect other traditions however there is a line and once it’s crossed, our own tradition with all it’s beauty loses it’s relevance.
It’s also based on quietism. As I understand it, Buddha taught that all suffering is caused by attachment; so the secret to ending suffering is to systematically detach oneself from every finite item in existence—thereby creating a spiritual vacuum which will then automatically, for Buddhists, create the state of satori, the awakened state; or, for Christians, be filled by by the mystical presence of God.
It is a denial, then, of the prerogatives of God and His grace relying, instead, on an alleged infallible technique.
Every religion contains some truth, it is said. Teaching that all suffering is caused by attachment has a kernal of truth in it. Catholic mysticism teaches us that detachment from the love of all things(except for their legitimate use) is necessary to empty oneself completely as the saints lives teach us, so that we are ready to be instruments of Christ’s will in all things. It is a necessary step. It’s very freeing.
I agree on the need for a discipline of detachment. As someone has observed “If you don’t deny yourself even licit goods, at times, where will you find the strength to reject illicit goods in times of great temptation?”
As a means to understanding the nature of happiness, though, I’m not so sure. In fact, in his biographical novel “The Quiet Light” Father Louis de Wohl has St. Thomas come to a conclusion seemingly the exact opposite to that of the Buddha.
Aquinas—at least as outlined in the novel—believed that the cause of suffering is precisely the separation of things which ought to be united.
Also, I suspect you’ve heard the old cliche: “Happiness is not about getting what you want; it’s about learning to want what you have.”
It sounds so mature and humble.
Well, in his essay “Happiness and Contemplation,” Josef PIeper demonstrates that St. Thomas believed quite the opposite: that final happiness is, again, found precisely in a union with one’s heart’s desire..
Yes, “union with one’s heart’s desire” is the kind of happiness that we naturally want and pursue. God calls us to come closer, to see the fleeting things as nothing or as temporary and to search for our lasting happiness in Him alone ” We are restless until we rest in Him.”
Loving Him above all else is, for myself, probably doable. Loving him to the exclusion of all else, as de Caussade speaks of, seems a science for saintly mystics only.
There is no other way to Heaven since Jesus has said, ” I am the Way, the Truth and the Light.” You’ve been blessed for returning to the Truth.
True.
It is therefore unlawful, and a profanation, and an act the punishment of which is death, to love to associate with unholy heretics, and to unite yourself to their communion. St. Cyril of Alexandria
For if they have doctrines opposed to ours, it is not fitting to be mixed up with them for this cause alone. […] What do you say? “Their faith is the same; these men are orthodox”? Why, then, are they not with us? St. John Chysostom
We have heard that many, saying they are Catholic, are living a life in common with Jews and pagans […] in diverse errors, maintaining that they are not being harmed. […] A great and deadly error! Pope Adrian I
I grieve for having been, if only for an hour, in communion with guilty men. St. Martin of Tours
It is an illusion to seek the company of sinners on the pretence of reforming them or of converting them; it is far more to be feared that they will spread their poison to us. St. Gregory Nazianzen
Do not converse with heretics even for the sake of defending the faith, for fear lest their words instil their poison in your mind. Bl. Isaias
The accursed perversity of heretics […] has so increased that now they exercise their wickedness not in secret, but manifest their error publicly, and win over the weak and simple-minded to their opinion. For this reason, We resolve to cast them, their defenders, and their receivers under anathema, and We forbid under anathema that any one presume to help heretics or to do business with heretics. III Lateran Council
Wow! Is this hate speech? It sounds like LOVE speech to me. This is the only love we can show to those who have gone astray, or who have been deceived – telling them the truth. Thanks for these quotes.
Thanks to our Lord and the faithful Catholics, the real Christ’s Church Fathers before our time.
And indeed, there is nothing hateful here, because we know that the main goal, the priority above all is salvation of the souls for eternity. Not having some kind of “good life” here on earth, as deceivers and traitors are trying to us believers of their heretical nonsense packed in cellophane called modernism, progress, etc…
… I cannot make this part more bold and visible to everyone:
“…For this reason, We resolve to cast them, their defenders, and their receivers under anathema, and We forbid under anathema that any one presume to help heretics or to do business with heretics”
What would be considered “doing business with heretics”? I just got something from Lowe’s (which isn’t exactly stellar morally), every week a Presbyterian lady (she’s pro-life and a big Trump supporter) gives me voice lessons, and I occasionally frequent a restaurant run by Eastern Orthodox.
The only alternative would be to move to someplace like St. Mary’s, KS, where practically the whole town is either FSSP or SSPX, which isn’t feasible for Mom and I.
Any ideas?
If you have five bakers in the city, you’ll buy bread from him who is Catholic.
If you have three dairies in the city, you will look to buy milk from the Catholic.
We need to search and find Catholic brothers and sisters, to live close with each others and to help each other first. A very good example for this is also this here and now, – our communicating on 1P5.
Eastern Orthodox Christians are not heretics, they are schismatics.
See also my answer to Julia.
If the Eastern Orthodox restaurant serves good Arabic food I would eat there. I’m half Lebanese.
If the Presbyterian lady is a good teacher I would hire her if I could sing, which I can’t. If they are ant-Catholic I would treat them like the plague.
Under this absolutism the Apostles would never have moved out to convert the world.
We just need to understand it properly.
“…We forbid under anathema that any one presume to help heretics”- in their heretical doing.
“..or to do business with heretics” – which means all kind of their heretical deeds, doing, speaking, writing, preaching, etc.
Love it is, for nothing is more hateful than endangering souls out of a love of the opinions of men.
Fr.’s ‘Jesuit’ atheism is showing.
As pointed out this is just awful. One question to Father Sosa, when is he going to accompany, or walk with, or dialogue with someone who really hates him and wants to kill him? Like an ISIS member? Or a member of any of the extremely hostile and violent groups we see on the news?
Not so easy as he leads us to believe – notice he has chosen Buddhists – those lovely, quiet, peaceful do-nothings? Here’s the truth: Sosa, like all of his ilk are more than happy to talk the talk, but they balk at ACTUAL encounter and accompaniment with the real world.
So easy to walk with an someone living in mortal sin, say adultery, or a poor dupe like a Buddhist. So much more difficult when that man or woman carries a knife with which he or she wants to hack at your throat.
Everything that comes out of the mouth of this man, and the thousands of other faithless Catholic priests, Bishops and Cardinals, Francis too, is a lie. Come on, Sosa, get out of the limo and start walking down a street in Syria, with your arms open wide to welcome and hug ANYONE you meet.
Hahhahaha, thanks 1P5, I needed a morning laugh. These silly pretend jesuits, what will they come up with next?
I agree — PRETEND JESUITS — that’s the operative word in your post — right on!
The authentic teaching of St. Ignatius of Loyola would NEVER condone or allow such pagan behavior from one who is supposedly in the “Company of Jesus.” There has been a wholesale apostasy from both the Catholic Faith and also the true, authentic teaching/spirituality of St. Ignatius of Loyola in most of the Jesuit order. There are a few, very few, exceptions. It is no wonder that we frequently see pictures of St. Ignatius of Loyola “in tears” — perhaps he was given the gift of crying as a type of ‘harbinger’ regarding the horror story that would happen in the Church in our day — largely supported by and even led by the false teaching of PRETEND Jesuits, including Karl Rahner. Our Lady warned of this “diabolical disorientation” that would take over the Church –. Now, if someone with some authority and COURAGE, would simply release the entire 3rd Secret of Fatima, we might have an opportunity for massive repentance. Barring that, we are undoubtedly on our way to a great chastisement to shake things up. Too many souls are being lost due to the antics of these false shepherds. Pray those Rosaries, daily, my friends!
I love Jesuits, I have a picture of St. Ignatius right here on my desk. I have made a pilgrimage to to Saint Francis Xavier’s home in Javier, Spain but sorry, the fruitcakes today running around calling themselves Jesuits are frauds.
I’ve always more trusted the Redemptorists.
Check that.
Tobin in Newark is a Redemptorist. He was the secretary of the “Congregation for Institutes of Consecrated Life and Societies of Apostolic Life” for two years until he showed his colors and Benedict removed him.
Religious life is dead but in a few yet overlooked pockets. Contemplative
nuns need by very wary indeed. Francis’ Apostolic Constitution “Vultum Dei Quaerere” put the bull’s eye on their backs last summer. History does repeat itself. The secular materialists of V2 did their best to erase Carmel in the late sixties. The Jesuits have their fingerprints all over the shipwreck of religious life, from the Trappists to Maryknoll.
SJ is more appropriately understood to refer to the Society of Judas.
Some time back in the early 80s I read a book, whose title I don’t recall, by a supposed Catholic priest whose views disturbed me.
I’ll never forget being both shocked and relieved when the Redemptorist priest I mentioned it to in Confession told me: “Just because a book has an Imprimatur doesn’t mean a Bishop has actually read it.”
The late Father Dunn. Always succinct, blunt and unapologetic when asked a question.
Can you provide some background on the erasing of Carmel reference? The Carmelites are my favorite religious order, and while I’ve heard this referenced before I have not been able to find a good explanation of what happened. Thanks in advance.
Matt, I too have an enormous respect – I will say reverence – for the
charism of the Discalced Carmelites.
Oddly enough a good “primary” resource of the initial attack on Carmel can be found in the early National Catholic Reporter. They had at least several very informative articles on this in 1966 and forward.
In the mid-sixties my sister entered a Carmel, at that moment entirely
traditional in its observance as were all – at that moment. In conformity to the “spirit of the council” the Discalced Nuns in the United States gathered in St. Louis in 1966 to discuss what “renewal” meant for them. Her thriving monastery of eighteen, a broad spectrum of ages, well populated with good young nuns as well as prudent seniors, steeped in the traditions of St. Teresa of Jesus found itself at the precipice. Only five years previous Carmel had celebrated the 400th anniversary of the Teresian reform. Now the decent into chaos, the Jesuits at Woodstock
(the irony!), the St. Louis meeting. Meeting after meeting. In two years it would be well into a transmutation characterized by painful chaos, division, recrimination, transfers, abandonment of the vision of Saint Teresa. My sister’s initial Carmel survived against many odds and today observes the 1990 Constitutions, although she did not, despite her
transfer to a Carmelite “resort” confected in the spirit of Vatican II. Her
destiny was to, let’s say, move beyond Bergoglianism on her own, while not a few monasteries did so collectively – decades in advance of 2013. Pope John Paul sought to remedy the fracture within Carmel in the eighties and was met with a nasty resistance cloaked under the same veneer of “theological superiority” presently holding pride of place throughout the Bergoglian confection. It resulted in two different sets of constitutions for the order, and no small number of individual observances.
Space does not allow for further analysis, let alone by an “outsider,” of a
world somewhat set apart, but it is safe to say that there are traditional
Carmels “thriving” in these dark days of the Church. “Hagan lio” will not prove to be any suitable substitute for “With zeal I have been zealous for the Lord.”
As Saint Teresa de Jesus admonished …
“My daughters and my ladies,
for the love of God I beg that you will take great care
with the keeping of the Rule and Constitutions,
for if you keep them as faithfully as you ought to,
no other miracle will be needed for your canonization.”
The contemplative orders are something of a barometer of the life of the Church. As a former contemplative religious myself, I shudder for what is upon us.
What order were you in?
Thank you, your reply was extremely helpful. I am confident that all that is true and holy will survive these dark years intact (if only barely) to one day flourish again. Our good Lord wills it so, and He cannot be thwarted. Discalced Carmelites possessing the spirit of their holy mother Teresa and holy father John will be raised up. I have hope that even one day the corrupted Jesuits will be renewed.
I agree that the contemplative orders are a barometer for the life of the Church. It is striking how every revolution, be it the French Revolution or Vatican II, strikes so viciously at the contemplatives. “The children of Israel have forsaken thy covenant: they have thrown down thy altars, they have slain thy prophets with the sword, and I alone am left, and they seek my life to take it away.” (3 Kings 19:10)
St. Teresa of Avila, pray for us. St. John of the Cross, pray for us. St. Therese of the Child Jesus and the Holy Face, pray for us. St. Elizabeth of the Trinity, pray for us. St. Teresa Benedicta of the Cross, pray for us. Our Lady of Mt. Carmel, pray for us. All you holy men and women, pray for us.
I do as well and, since I’m enrolled in the brown scapular (thank God), technically I am one.
It is said that there is no weeping in Heaven; but St Ignatius has every right!
Whew. It’s almost like the 1973 movie Conflict (aka “Catholics”) with Martin Sheen is being brought to life.
The final shot of Trevor Howard as the abbot who had lost his faith, kneeling down in prayer anyway for the sake of the brothers—and the look of utter despair on his face—was absolutely haunting.
tenia que ser jesuita…◄ Isaías 5:20 ►
¡Ay de los que llaman al mal bien y al bien mal, que tienen las tinieblas por luz y la luz por tinieblas, que tienen lo amargo por dulce y lo dulce por amargo!
Si. Es muy triste.
Lo que estamos viendo es el mundo al revés. Es cada vez más difícil resistir la idea de que estamos en el Fin de los Tiempos.
Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.” – John 14:6
So from that photo fr.Sousa is showing the world that you can come to the Father through Buddha.
And this is the same guy who doesn’t believe in the devil. This guy is a HERETIC yet we are housing and feeding him? The Church is in total chaos because of too many Judases.
That is what I think every time I read of any of the characters who have infiltrated our Church: ‘We’re housing and feeding them’! Probably, not even half of them could get a job that would support their lifestyles, yet they live quite comfortably, doing whatever they like, and scoffing at those who are paying for their food and housing, not to mention travel, parties, etc. It is so sad.
Gee….I wonder what Jorge Bergoglio has to say about this…… https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/a2efa5fa5509c7b36af9524e61aef2840050fe3482d0ece93db32714f4fe0a5c.jpg
Love that Tucker!!!!! Plain questions that cut to the heart of the idiocy at hand.
I’d love to see him interview Frank.
HAEC EST HORA VESTRA ET POTESTAS TAENEBRARUM
Steve: A small correction. That phrase is LITERALLY translated “baptized himself” but it is best rendered into English as “to be baptized.” So the best translation for the sentence is,”Father Sosa is officially the first Jesuit Superior to be baptized Buddhist.”
Thanks. I checked the translation with a fluent speaker, and he seemed confident that it was reflexive. Which, in a way, seems like it would make sense, since there’s no such thing as Buddhist baptism, and Sosa essentially self-initiated by doing this.
Johnny, Steve.
Maybe I missed it, but I have a question: Where does it EXACTLY read:
[El] “Padre Sosa es oficialmente el primer Superior Jesuita en bautizarse budista.”?
Yes, the phrase – if it is EXACTLY that – is reflective, and means
“Father Sosa is officially the first Jesuit Superior to baptize himself Buddhist.”,
which is NOT the same as:
“Father Sosa is officially the first Jesuit Superior in Buddhist Baptism”
Rigorously, baptizing himself is not EXACTLY the same as participating in a Buddhist Baptism (whatever it means).
Of course, that wouldn’t change the context of Sosa’s participation in that celebration of “Baptism” (if there was such a ceremony)
I hope I’m clear enough. In summary, my doubt is:
what is the EXACT reference Internet LINK (in Spanish, I mean).
Please excuse my intromission to ask for the original link in Spanish.
In my understanding, a clear reference to it would be mandatory in the article, so as to leave no place for any misunderstanding, confusion or suspicion, especially among those of us whose original language is Spanish.
Thanks to both.
J L Montero – Argentina
If you follow the link above to the original post, it’s in Spanish. You just have to mouse over the picture, because they stuck the caption in the title tag.
But I can show it to you here, because I grabbed a screenshot of the code:
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/21bcba796abbc6b198bb37648bee78eda7397446ac9b33444db830ffd9662b22.png
Hi guys, you are all making this too difficult.
“Father Sosa is the first Jesuit Superior who got an official immersion into Buddhism” (lit. Buddhist)
If this is meant to be purely reflexive, as it seems, then there is only one reasonable English translation, and it has absolutely NOTHING to do with baptism per se, viz. “Father Sosa is officially the first Jesuit Superior to call himself Buddhist.” “Bautizar” has the secondary meaning of calling someone or something by a different name, e.g. “La compañía bautizó su barco Salvación para darle un aspecto religioso.” = “The company called its ship Salvation to give it a religious aspect.” It is also, of course, a rather clever double entendre, given the case it is being applied to.
JohnnyCuredents,
You are right. Your example is correct, too.
* “Bautizar” (in Spanish) means “to baptize”, with the two possible meanings you mention. I know of no other meaning. “Bautizar” is referred to the person who PERFORMS the action of baptism..
The second meaning of “bautizar” can also be used in Spanish as a synonym of “naming”, with no religious implications.
* “Bautizarse” (reflexive) in its common usage in Spanish, is ONLY referred to the action of “being baptized”, and it is ONLY meant for persons who RECEIVE the sacrament of Baptism. It also assumes that the action of baptizing is executed by another (the priest, or the person who performs the action of Baptism). The reflexive mode cannot be applied to a non-human (which – by definition – cannot baptize itself), since it ONLY has a meaning within the context of the sacrament of Baptism.
I hope this helps.
J L Montero – Argentina.
Thank you, Steve.
I’m not too good at computer codes, captions and screenshots…
Sorry…
I have to disagree with the consensus here. There is a buddhist initiation ceremony, equivalent to the Catholic baptism, which is called “taking refuge”, and it’s applicable right across all branches of buddhism. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refuge_(Buddhism).
Well if buddha is the ‘fully enlightened one’ then entering that baptism is a sacrilege.
I don’t even know what to say. I will go and pray a rosary for these men. Lord have mercy on their souls. And perhaps I will take some time off reading and commenting because I am heartbroken. I think it can’t get any worse, and it does.
“…when one holds THEIR mouse…”
“…HIS mouse…”
Catholics should be refusing to use tranny pronouns.
That’s right! “Their” is plural.
Doubtlessly more far more Marxist than Catholic, now we are to believe he is more Buddhist than Marxist.
Sosa has committed an act under canon law known as “notorious defection”. He is, therefore, no longer Catholic and outside of the Catholic Church, and is canonically an apostate. No Jesuit owes him obedience, and no Catholic should receive sacraments from his hand, if they know about his notorious, public defection.
I bet he’s being possessed voluntarily. Satan in “Michelle Remembers, page 179″ once said, ” The only way out is to burn.
Mater Ecclesiae, ora pro nobis!
(festina!!!!)
Fr. Sosa is a Reprobate and will die a Reprobate if he does not repent. Fr. Sosa knows the rules of engaging other fake religions in their rituals. He decided with his free will to participate to draw himself into a scandalous act against the Catholic Church.
I’ll bet you dollars to donuts he does not in the least see himself as having denied the Faith, rather, he sees himself as engaging in the depths of it. Letter of the law with these types is the veneer that only “deplorables” follow, while the experimenters accrue to themselves the credit for “really understanding” the occult meaning hidden in the spirit of those laws. I do know enough of these folks, lay and ordained, who have created a labyrinth in their minds that an ordinary believer would not see —- or would run from!!! —– but which those who engage sincerely believe traces them back to a firm connection to Truth. This is the meaning of the pejorative “jesuitical” when applied to reasoning. Loopholes reign.
I’ll bet you one Lifesaver that if Fr. Sosa does not repent that Sin against the Catholic Church he will go to Hell.
Vincible ignorance does not excuse Sin from Judgement especially from the Superior General of a major order.
It is also only natural that a Reprobate like Fr. Sosa are blinded to the Sacred teachings of the Catholic Church and it’s understanding because he rejected those teachings.
Sometime in in the past few years I “clipped” an article by Roberto de Mattei entitled “Why We Should Not Discredit the Society of Jesus.” It was quick job and I did not reference from where I got it, but from among the many fascinating insights he provides (as always) I quote:
“Among the most disastrous consequences of the pontificate of Pope Francis there are two, closely related to each other: the first is the misrepresentation of typically Christian virtue of obedience; the second is the discrediting of the Society of Jesus and its founder St. Ignatius of Loyola.”
And…
“…of particular interest in 1569 was a revelation that St. Francesco Borgia, provost general of the order, “God revealed to me – said the Spanish saint – that none of those who have lived, live or will live in the Company, dying in it, will be sentenced, for the space of three hundred years. It ‘the same grace that was already made to the Order of Saint Benedict ”
The Jesuits were founded in 1540, the privilege of salvation for those who have died within the Society, extends until 1840, leaving out the following generations. And it is indeed the end of the nineteenth century began the decline of the order founded by St. Ignatius, though with many exceptions. This decline had a significant expression in the years of the Second Vatican Council, where a decisive role was played by the Jesuit Karl Rahner, and especially in those that followed
when, under his father’s government Arrupe, the upgraded Jesuits, in various forms, the liberation theology in Latin America.”
“Today a Jesuit pope, formed at the school of liberation theology, feeds the crisis in the Church.”
Again, this is a very rich article, but I cannot determine from where it was gleaned.
Thanks for naming it so we can locate it.
If you find it let me know. I’ve looked in vain. I think it might have been Rorate Caeli, but my search there did not produce a result.
Ditto but thanks.
Outrageous.
I needed a laugh, however brutal…
I have said it in another post in this thread today – but it bears repeating at the end of the day, after reading all the true but horrendous conversations that testify to the Apostasy that has & is overtaking us. We are living through exactly what Our Lady warned about in the yet, undisclosed, 3rd Secret of Fatima. There is clearly a “diabolical disorientation” that has overturned and eclipsed the True Faith. The full contents of the 3rd Secret of Fatima must be revealed by those in the know. They have a moral obligation to do so, beginning with Pope Benedict XVI – for the sake of all the souls that are now being lost due to this Apostasy. Pray the Rosary, my friends. Our Lady told us that only “She” – the Lady of the Rosary – can save us. It has been given to Her, by the Blessed Trinity, to crush the head of Satan. We must be Her foot-soldiers in this battle! The Rosary and the True Mass are our weapons!
What will it take, canonically, to have the Jesuits shut down?
White smoke would be the first step!
The Jesuits always seem to be at the cutting edge of risky ecclesial activities. I hope to see more articles about the dangers of ecumenism please. I really believe we Catholics in the pews need lots of help to thoroughly understand the principles involved. Some helpful comments are below quoting early Church Fathers warning about spending lots of time with heretics. I dont recall The Church ever spelling out these dangers in the last 50 years. The worst excesses of ecumenism have now arrived and I believe the Mass itself is in more danger. The Pope has expanded the idea of who can be declared a Saint by the Church and it includes other Christians! So any old truth to die for is just fine!
There have been reports that there is an engagement with protestants in northern Italy to confect a ceremony that is “mass-like” that will allow for “interfaith eucharist.” I appreciate your noting the modification of the criteria for the consideration for beatification and canonization. It is a deeply serious event and is being glossed over as inconsequential.
The obsessive-compulsive drive among a certain class of the episcopate and the laity to “liberate” Catholics from all manner of measure stems from their own seriously deficient commitment to, and fear of, living out Christian life – and it stems from faithlessness. The abandonment of vice and the acquiring of virtue – the taking up of the cross – is the measure of Christian life. Jesus Christ Himself is the measure.
“Enter by the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is easy, * that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. For the gate is narrow and the way is hard, that leads to life, and those who find it are few.” Matthew 7:13-14 – and it need be
read in the context of the entire chapter.
A church where a Pope muses no one goes to Hell and the Superior General of the Jesuits consigns the existence of Satan to literary and psychological devise is in the most serious need of criteria, particularly when choosing individuals for office.
The “big tent” replacing St. Peter’s Square appears as nothing more than a three ring circus inhabited by corpulent clowns manifestly unable to exercise governance of a range of appetites with consequences far more serious than being a blow to the eye. The
holy priesthood, the exercise of the office of bishop, is “in persona Christi,’ not the emulation of Captain Kangaroo or Mr. Rogers.
There can be no such thing as interfaith eucharist as receiving the Eucharist signifies believing all the the catholic church teaches and holds to be true so that would be sacrilege. So such a mass would involve those present in the sacrilege.it looks like this is the direction we are heading.
You know that.
I know that.
We are rigid Pharisees.
They are superior both intellectually and morally and they know things that aren’t so.
Maybe Maxine Waters could be Pope.
If this Leader of the Jesuits is, indeed, a practicing Buddhist or in any way connected with that religion, then he has to go. The problem with the Jesuit Order is that, at one time, it was the Popes right arm. Then, over the years, it became too smart by half. I said when Pope Francis was elected, it was a mistake. You can’t ever trust the Jesuits and you can’t trust either the Pope or the so-called “Black Pope”. The Church is in Crisis. Francis is still the Holy Father and Successor to Peter but, I really have my doubts he was elected with the help of the Holy Spirit. I think he was elected by the conspiracy of the St. Galen Group. The sooner he retires, the better our Church will be.
” I really have my doubts he was elected with the help of the Holy Spirit.”
He was elected by Cardinals, as were most Popes before him.
Actually, Uncle Joe, if the history of the last Papal election is anywhere close to the truth, the Holy Spirit had nothing to do with Bergoglio’s election. However, the St. Galen Group of Cardinals sure influenced the outcome of that election. They (The St. Galen Group of Cardinals & supporters) wanted a liberation theologist. They had engineered the retirement of the traditionalist Pope Emeritus. They found the man they were looking for in Cardinal Bergoglio of Argentina .
My point (probably badly expressed) was that Popes are elected by men, not by the Holy Ghost.
It’s a Catholic myth that a Pope is elected by God – the inference of the ignorant being that he is then also God, or nearly so.
Every pope is very much elected by men, under the influence of the Holy Spirit..or, not, but it’s always turned out better when they were.
I doubt it personally, I take Saint Francis’s words as truth about our time now: “a man not canonically elected, will be raised to the Pontificate.”
I think this man has an ego comparable to that of Bishop Bergoglio. Their pridefulness brings them even to clownish behavior, when not worse.
Buddhism is to make no harm, while Christianity is transmitting God’s Love.
This man can pretend being very intellectual, original, of superior understanding, but he is offending the Christian faith with this episode and with many former ones.
Some clerics in South America probably enjoy the admiration of the less instructed people, to whom they abuse intellectually; the people they call “the poor”. They like the poor so much that in Venezuela they have contributed to create millions of them. Some of those clerics come to Rome and treat all Christianity as they used to do in their dioceses.
For example:
“All should accept that global warming is a fact”
https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/vatican-archbishop-all-should-accept-that-global-warming-is-a-fact
If the main purpose of Buddhism is emancipation from all forms of dualistic thought, I hope, at least, it heals duplicity.
Just one more bad example for the boys and girls NOT to follow. God bless. Ginnyfree.
He should resign and let another Jesuit faithful to the teaching of St. Ignatius be elected.
The question is does such an individual exist?
Increasingly doubtful, to put a positive spin on it.
In the Consecration you posted (which I like very much) are the words:
“Be Thou King of all those who are still involved in the darkness of idolatry or of Islamism, and refuse not to draw them into the light and kingdom of God.”
Should we not also pray for the graces we need to cooperate with God’s plan to just that, so that God can be “all in all, everything to everyone (CCC130) and accomplish, through us, “God is in Christ reconciling all things” (2 Cor. 5:19)?
Along that thought, would it be good if all parents prayed the following with their children and expected all ministers of all faiths to join together and publicly encourage everyone to pray in the same manner in the sure faith that God wants all to pray to do so and will bless all who persevere in seeking HIS HELP to believe all the truths that God wants everyone to want to know?
The prayer: Please God, in your infinite mercy and goodness, give me, my family, friends, enemies, everyone, and especially ministers of all faiths to publicly support this, give us all the help we need to pray all our lives for the help to always seek your help to know and believe all the truths that YOU want everyone to want to know and therefore never get complacent or presumptuous, but let us always seek you with our whole hearts. Thank you Lord God for your mercy and love.
Could such a public prayer by believers of all faiths be a start to cooperating with God’s plan to reconcile all things through peaceful means?
Could any “believer” publicly oppose such a public prayer?
Jesuit numbers in 1965 – 36038
Jesuit numbers in 2017 – 16378
Heresy leads to apostasy which leads to disappearance.
Under the reign of Fr Arturo and the hegemony of Poep francis the decline and eventual disappearance of the Jesuits is virtually guaranteed.
How the great St Ignatius must now be weeping …
Jesuit numbers in 2017 – 16378? The numbers are not dropping fast enough.
Modernists/ syncretists– “All religions are equal: especially Buddhism.”? Just sad.
The enthusiasm in Sosa’s face is revealing. It can be read more as an act of defiance to Catholicism rather than someone even remotely interested in what he’s doing.
They like the camera, these enlightened Jesuit wisdom figures.
Anybody think we will see holiness and consistent teaching of the One True Church in the next 40 years or so?
Or are we stuck with faggots and Muslim apologists and Marxist revolutionaries among those who do the lion’s share of the teaching?
What did Jesus say? “Night cometh when no man can teach”. And in terms of passing on the faith, people who rock up to a Parish enquiring about the Catholic faith are more likely to be the ones chasing down the latest comments from Pope Francis, thinking they are doing the right thing, thinking he is THE spokesman for Catholics. You can imagine the dilemma, when a whole lot of people sound more Catholic than the Pope. Even Scott Hahn in the late 80’s had to knock on several presbytery doors before finding a Priest to instruct him. Some were saying stay where you are Scott!. Now we have a Pope who takes the same line. I dont imagine any Bishop is going to publically declare “Night has come” unless it is Pope Emeritus, although Fr. Linus Clovis came close I figure. So that gets down to everyone figuring out, considering the work they are engaged in, what is possible and what is not.
Well, I know there are holy priests out there. Many young ones, too.
As for the prelature, well…it’s quite shocking.
This article highlights the particular dangers in interfaith relationships. Many people are going to assume that Buddhists worship God, and it is too tempting to assume that the Buddhist ‘god’ is in fact the God we Catholics worship; this kind of thinking is already being stretched amongst Catholics because of the commonly held and mostly Church-defended position that Christians and Muslims worship the same God, and that we three – Jews, Muslims and Christians are the 3 Abrahamic religions. So Catholics are being primed to just accept whatever the current thinking coming out of Rome states! Very sad.
This is a new religion being gagged up by these frauds.
Buddhists don’t believe in God and it appears this Sosa fellow doesn’t as well.
Trouble is – many before Sosa, in the 60’s, headed off to the east looking for common ground – I assume – people like Bede Griffiths, Thomas Merton, John Main, and Merton made similar statements (as Sosa’s) about Zen Buddhism – saying he could be a buddhist and Christian at the same time. Those guys were never officially corrected, because I think there was then a wave of unrealistic optimism sweeping through the Church. So decades went by and “Jesus the Water Bearer of Life” only came out from the Pontifical Council for Culture about 2003 condemning the “roots” of eastern mysticism, but that important document was titled “A Christian Reflection”!!!!! A reflection! So apologetic! Was it read by Priests from their pulpits around the country to inform Catholics ? No! The Hierarchy have been indulgent towards these men, and the Theologians supporting this kind of thinking. It was as if the sheep in the pews did not matter at all. All that mattered was how they accepted and listened to eachother. Such naivety!
Make Jesuits Catholic Again!
In modest defense of Buddhism…
St. Thomas somewhere says that: to know that someone is coming down the hall is not to know that Peter is coming down the hall. It’s only when Peter actually comes through the door that we know it’s he.
Men who lived before the time of Christianity and who had no contact with Judaism, sensed that there was something greater than themselves—that is, they knew that Someone was coming down the hall, so to speak—and they made a stab at guessing Who/What he was.
Unlike Islam, which arose “after Peter walked through the door”—after the birth of Christ, when the Author of the universe fully revealed Himself—and was conceived in a Satanic denial of His divinity, one may have a healthy though distant regard for such noble achievements of the human spirit, unaided by supernatural grace.
Certainly if Satan is able to enter even the sanctuary of the Church, he is fully capable of quickly corrupting these human achievements; but with the exception of Islam, the other world religions were not necessarily Satanic in origin.
To expect that Buddhism, Hinduism, Confucianism, Taoism, etc. should have arrived at a knowledge of Christ is to expect the impossible, since His time had not yet come.
Islam arose AFTER the fullness of time, and denies the Truth. Whereas a Buddhist today, may deny Christ, Buddhism in its inception did not deny Him, it simply couldn’t know Him. Islam has never had an excuse.
Sickening.